[koolguysk8r14]

can someone please explain the 4 eye system or draw a picture or something. very confused.

[bcoffron]

I found this from The Incubus in another thread:

I Posted this in the News section just yesterday in response to a lame assumption that Bob's New Eye System is a Gimmick/Marketing Ploy

In JT's system, the second set of eyes is a backup system that acts as a safety in the event one set fails and BOTH sets are located at the base of the breech.

Now with the System on Bob's NEW ONYX, both sets of eyes have 2 different locations. One in the feedneck & one at the bottom of the breech. TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

Bob's system was designed to have they eyes communicate with one another in order to TIME the feedrate of the loader mounted on the Marker. It times how long it takes for a ball to travel from the TOP SET OF EYES located in the feedneck to the BOTTOM SET OF EYES located in the base of the breech. The purpose of this is to syncronize the Marker's firing rate with the feedrate of the loader in order to optimize both systems performance. Furthermore it serves to reduce ball breaks to an absolute minimum since the system constantly monitors the feedrate of your loader and in the event your batteries start to lose their juice, the system will recognize it and adjust the firing rate accordingly.

Still think it's the same thing?... Think Again!

[the incubus]

Actually... I posted that.

[xXinpayneXx]

I dont think the 2 sets of eyes are really neccicery.

Becuase the 1 pair of eyes tell if theres a ball in it or not, why does it matter that your gun knows how fast your hopper is feeding?

If theres a ball in there, than it can fire, if theres not one then it wont.

They should follow the old rule.... KISS (keep it simple stupid)

[the incubus]

Originally Posted by xXinpayneXx

I dont think the 2 sets of eyes are really neccicery.

Becuase the 1 pair of eyes tell if theres a ball in it or not, why does it matter that your gun knows how fast your hopper is feeding?

If theres a ball in there, than it can fire, if theres not one then it wont.

They should follow the old rule.... KISS (keep it simple stupid)

Ahh... But that KISS theory of yours would not allow the higher shot rate of this engenious design without a higher volume of chops.

Not saying that this is a fool proof system, but certainly it has already proven to shoot at an extremely high rate of fire WITHOUT chopping.

Perhaps Terry can come in here & elaborate further.

[Lurker27]

My question about this system is if it is actaully attempting to make it so the ball stack DOESN'T STOP on the bolt.


AKA...How fast is it with a gravity loader?

[paintballkilla*]

Originally Posted by xXinpayneXx

I dont think the 2 sets of eyes are really neccicery.

Becuase the 1 pair of eyes tell if theres a ball in it or not, why does it matter that your gun knows how fast your hopper is feeding?

If theres a ball in there, than it can fire, if theres not one then it wont.

They should follow the old rule.... KISS (keep it simple stupid)

actually the onxy does KISS you cant mess w/ dwell to much or too little very good idea IMO

[assassinationACI]

If you want KISS get a spyder. If we wanted to keep it simple stupid then we would never made as far as we did in technology. KISS is an opinion, if you dont want something complicated then dont get it.

[alexjl (Banned)]

this explains everything
http://www.motherfinmike.com/videos/zli.wmv

[Lurker27]

No, it doesn't, at all.

[raymius (Banned)]

Basically the upper eyes sense the ball dropping into the breach and the main set (Lower) make sure the ball is in the breech (like all other eyes do).

The second set of eyes is only needed if you want to shoot at 20+ BPS, and we always need to be shooting that fast . Good idea if current markers were limited due by ball recognition, but they are not. The fact of the matter is the main set of eyes (the ones at the bottom) are the ones that matter. I have yet to chop a ball in my timmy, but that may be due to the fact that I wasn't trying for 20+ BPS.

[leadfoot100]

Originally Posted by Lurker27

No, it doesn't, at all.

LOL

[Lurker27]

I understand WHY it is there, I am simply thinking about how it achieves synchronization with the bolt. I mean, if you ONLY had an eye at the top of the breech, and you knew you had a HALO, you would STILL be ALOT faster than a bottom of the breech eye, because you know that the ball is dropping in with spring tension (assuming the ball got there quick enough in the first place). This si why angels are naturally faster than timmies...The eye is higher. So, what I would program it like is:

if the top eye sees a ball immediately, assume spring tension and fire a ball, knowing the HALO will load fast enough to settle it. If the top eye sees a ball after a while, wait until we are SURE the ball has settled (poll the bottom eye).

[leadfoot100]

I think you're on teh right track lurker. but here's my programing logic of the eye's:

I would have the board keep a constant running calculating application running in the background not interfearing with the firing sequence. What that calculation proccess would do is measure the time it takes between eyes1 and eyes2. but that time into a table and have a constant average of maybe say the last 5 readings. That average would then tell the board what the current loader delay should be for the next shot.

what do ya think? A little much, but could potentially make it very fast, depending on the calculation speed.

I think either way, it would be Motha f'n fast

[Wenuliveudie]

Originally Posted by assassinationACI

If you want KISS get a spyder. If we wanted to keep it simple stupid then we would never made as far as we did in technology. KISS is an opinion, if you dont want something complicated then dont get it.

KISS does not mean a direct lack of development. KISS merely means "Do not over engineer". For example, KISS could be used on the Autococker and develop into a Timmy or Spyder.

Sorry, just something that bugs me. Didn't mean to take it off topic.

[Icedrelm]

Ok this may be wrong, but My local shop owner says that when in stream, it shoots an extra ball, so for example, if you shoot 11 balls, you get 12, Any one confirm this? If so is it legal?

Jeff

[Lurker27]

Originally Posted by leadfoot100

I think you're on teh right track lurker. but here's my programing logic of the eye's:

I would have the board keep a constant running calculating application running in the background not interfearing with the firing sequence. What that calculation proccess would do is measure the time it takes between eyes1 and eyes2. but that time into a table and have a constant average of maybe say the last 5 readings. That average would then tell the board what the current loader delay should be for the next shot.

what do ya think? A little much, but could potentially make it very fast, depending on the calculation speed.

I think either way, it would be Motha f'n fast

This will lead to chopping if you predict the next ball to be fed under the same force as the average of the previous 5. I doubt this uses much of a loader delay hard coded.

[Bayne]

Originally Posted by Icedrelm

Ok this may be wrong, but My local shop owner says that when in stream, it shoots an extra ball, so for example, if you shoot 11 balls, you get 12, Any one confirm this? If so is it legal?

Jeff

not true.

[Icedrelm]

Thank you Mr bayne.

Jeff

[Bayne]

[M0nkWitaGat]

the top eyes detect the ball droping into the chamber, the bottom ones check the ball is correctly in the breach.. what the vid on pbstar zach long explains the whole thing ill go look for a link if someone didnt post it already