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Old 09-13-2006, 08:49 PM #43
Terry59
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Vegard,
Manike may not be god, but he is one of the top and one of the most respected engineers in this industry. You and the everyday baller may not know of his accomplishments and contributions to this sport, but he has the respect and admiration of his peers, the likes of Tom Kaye, John Rice, Jack Wood, John Sosta, and Bob. Manike could at a still a relatively young age live off the paintball and automotive patent proceeds that he has already established. Only other people that do that in paintball is the Gardners.
I feel quite comfortable and confident that whenever Manike makes a contribution here or the industry it's a fact and it's gonna work.
.
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Last edited by Terry59 : 09-13-2006 at 08:57 PM.
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Old 09-13-2006, 08:51 PM #44
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All guns started somewhere. Practically every gun began with a spyder in mind since it practically was one of the simplest semi-automatic. So the freestyle is a super mag? And the dm is a super duper nova? Its like laws above laws, you cant go under the law to make another law because it makes conflict. When you make a gun, its hard to start from scratch, your design is always BASED on what was made before. Luckily spyder was the gun that was based off tons of guns. Egos were based there gun off the intimidator platform but changed it around. You might as well tell nissan to stop making trucks that is based off other trucks.
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Old 09-13-2006, 08:52 PM #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lurker27
To be fair, the ego ram design is a little different in that the forward and back strokes are BOTH behind the bolt pin
Now what would people say if they cloned exactly as the Intimidator.
They got to make at least a little different.
The Ego is a great execution a blend of earlier designs.
BTW, the new Ego bolt, Manike prototyped that 3 years ago.
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Old 09-13-2006, 08:59 PM #46
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Its called innovation....i think

oh, and if manike isnt a god...hes pretty ****ing close...he made the belt driven loader for christ's sake
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Old 09-13-2006, 09:38 PM #47
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Terry you need to go help joe build our guns, I think our order will total 20 on Friday

so keep scrubbing cinderella! hahaha

let's get started on those Rendition Alias's! w00t

I want my onyx now
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Old 09-13-2006, 10:38 PM #48
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stupid 2k6er.......................... jk
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Old 09-13-2006, 11:25 PM #49
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Well Rendition Tech I'll be at Bob's place Monday I believe. But hey lets not forget and let go the excellent work commenced by the employees that make the gun actually come out to us. I'm sure the new guns will be ready as fast as it is humanly possible.

But yea after reading this thread I'm really sad because I just got back from San Diego NPPL and there I was working with Nick T. and Gerry and a few of the Eclipse techs, they seemed really cool. Then I come here and, well I hope Eclipse gun owners aren't really like this otherwise my days teching with the EGO techs will be hellish.

And a side note. Don't demean, insult, belittle or produce any negativity towards people such as Terry or Manike I know both of them and have the upmost respect for them. And actually it would probably be wise not to challenge them for your own sake or you will get (as I quote from someone before) OWNED.

Have a nice day and I hope you all get a chance to shoot this new blessing of a gun.
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Old 09-14-2006, 04:39 PM #50
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Originally Posted by icdbko32
quit bashing systems and guns, people build guns, other people make them better, so what.
I dont bash companies for copying

I bash companies for copying, putting on 20 dollar qev's and doubling the price, and saying "They came out with the technology"
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Old 09-14-2006, 04:42 PM #51
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If there is one thing I ask... it is to have FAKE TIMMYS WITH QEV'S ATTACHED TO THEIR HEAD!!

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Old 09-14-2006, 05:13 PM #52
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Originally Posted by Rendition Tech
If there is one thing I ask... it is to have FAKE TIMMYS WITH QEV'S ATTACHED TO THEIR HEAD!!

brilliant
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Old 09-14-2006, 06:46 PM #53
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Originally Posted by Rendition Tech
If there is one thing I ask... it is to have FAKE TIMMYS WITH QEV'S ATTACHED TO THEIR HEAD!!


HAHAHA!!!!... I just about spit out my soda
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Old 09-14-2006, 10:25 PM #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peegee
Hmmmmm so we go from an pnumatic spider to a pnumatic tippman good skills there IMO also the 4 eye thing cause that wasnt taken from the JT quadra now was it???? hmmm and just been checking patents jt seems to have one on it could be fun there!
I Posted this in the News section just yesterday in response to a lame assumption that Bob's New Eye System is a Gimmick/Marketing Ploy

I'll school on the DIFFERENCE between the dual Eyes on BOTH Markers (ONYX & QUADRA) and perhaps you will realize that it IS NOT a Marketing Ploy/Gimmick on Bob's part to boost interest & sales.

This is a screen capture of the Quadra instructions:


In JT's system, the second set of eyes is a backup system that acts as a safety in the event one set fails and BOTH sets are located at the base of the breech.

Now with the System on Bob's NEW ONYX, both sets of eyes have 2 different locations. One in the feedneck & one at the bottom of the breech. TOTALLY DIFFERENT.

Bob's system was designed to have they eyes communicate with one another in order to TIME the feedrate of the loader mounted on the Marker. It times how long it takes for a ball to travel from the TOP SET OF EYES located in the feedneck to the BOTTOM SET OF EYES located in the base of the breech. The purpose of this is to syncronize the Marker's firing rate with the feedrate of the loader in order to optimize both systems performance. Furthermore it serves to reduce ball breaks to an absolute minimum since the system constantly monitors the feedrate of your loader and in the event your batteries start to lose their juice, the system will recognize it and adjust the firing rate accordingly.

Still think it's the same thing?... Think Again!
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Old 09-14-2006, 11:04 PM #55
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Now guys...I thought you all knew that whatever the PBN kids hype about is the best marker made.

Every gun shoots a paintball. To the people who want to spend 1850 on a gun, whatever floats your boat. Just realize you are buying nothing more than a hyped product.
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Old 09-15-2006, 04:45 AM #56
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Very interesting thread.

Some people have NO concept of how many many paintball guns work.

The electropneumatic platform that the Timmy, Ego, Impulse, 'Borg, Bushmaster etc etc etc ALL work off is a derivation of the Angel.

Yes, I said Angel.

WDP were the first company to drive a weight connected to a bolt, into a poppet valve, by means of a ram and solenoid valve.

From there we have had all the above mentioned guns, plus hundreds of others.

Terry has been a true gentleman in conveying his thoughts on the matter, and the only thing I would disagree with would be his last statement regarding what Eclipse would be doing if it wasn't for the Spyder and Timmy. Well he can rest assured that we wouldn't still be making Cockers (BTW we always used genuine WGP bodies in our cockers, unlike some, so is that still cloning?).

Planet was actually heavily involved in the design and development of the original Angel. A lot of mine, and others within Planet, time and thought went into that first gun, and that continued with the Eclipse Angels for those first few years.

It is with great sadness that I realize that it is probably some dirty scum-bag chav in this forum who thought it would find it funny to rip down our tech banners, hang them up in the firing range, and shoot them, in San Diego. Very classy.

As a passing thought, to you guys celebrating your new Onyx (and a friendly little rebuttal to Terry ) : do you think there would ever have been an Onyx if there had never been an Ego?

Peace

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Old 09-15-2006, 08:11 AM #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Wood
As a passing thought, to you guys celebrating your new Onyx (and a friendly little rebuttal to Terry ) : do you think there would ever have been an Onyx if there had never been an Ego?

Peace

Jack Wood
I absolutely believe the onyx would have been released, with or without the ego.

Jack I appreciate you taking the time to post in my thread. Believe it or not, I do own an Ego. It's an older model, I bought it out of curiosity and use it every now and then.

It's got it's quirks like any gun, and since you took the time to post in the thread, I will give you constructive feedback on the ego. My dislikes-

no lpr guage - lpr guages protect that $100 solenoid
different allen keys for LPR and HPR- more tools to carry to the chrono!
trigger- I mostly shoot semi auto, I like a longer trigger pull. The magnet at the top of the frame really causes alot of problems with a longer trigger pull (I know the newer triggers are different, havent bought one yet)

Ego's are great guns, no one has ever disputed that. You made a great product

But I personally believe Bob would have created the Onyx without the influence of anyone.

If you look at the progression of Bob's guns, you see a timeline of research and development. Classic, 2k2, alias, infamous, now the onyx

Egos are still egos
Shockers are still shockers


Dye has been doing pretty good, in terms of their guns getting smaller and more efficient every year.

That sucks someone did that to your banners, that shows a lack of class and professionalism, but then again, this is paintball. Everytime I think this sport cant possibly do anything more to hurt it's image, I get surprised every day!
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Old 09-15-2006, 10:09 AM #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rendition Tech
no lpr guage - lpr guages protect that $100 solenoid
different allen keys for LPR and HPR- more tools to carry to the chrono!
trigger- I mostly shoot semi auto, I like a longer trigger pull. The magnet at the top of the frame really causes alot of problems with a longer trigger pull (I know the newer triggers are different, havent bought one yet)
I'd like to respond to this with a semi-legitimate post.

My Nexus Ego came packaged with a Star FRM with a guage for my LPR. While I realize that this does not happen normally, it still is out there. (Hence the semi-legitimacy of my post)

The different allen keys are alleviated by me having a single tool with many allen keys on it. (Once again, semi-legitimate)

The stock triggers on both my Nexus and my 05 Empire Timmy did not feel good either, and had short trigger pulls. I alleviated both with aftermarket CP roller triggers. (See a pattern?) Also the magnet screw in my Ego is removable, and I rely solely on my spring (must have a STAR frame).

While I realize that those refutes aren't wholly acceptable because, for the most part, they don't come stock, $25 here and there will fix the problem.


Now, onto Bob Long not producing the Onyx without an Ego. While I greatly respect Mr. Woods and do not question his knowledge of paintball, it has been stated many times by Mr. Long in interviews that the main driving force behind him developing his new marker is a discontent with NPS. He wanted to get away from the Intimidator line because he felt pressured and that NPS wasn't holding up their end of the deal. I believe he created the Onyx as an attempt to both further the technology of paintball markers and to further distance himself from the company.

Part of the reason why I enjoy the Ego and the Intimidator forums is because they have a sense of brotherhood. It irks me when one or the other claims superiority. I think, instead, a close relationship should be held between the two, and for the most part, am glad to see this occuring.
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Old 09-15-2006, 10:52 AM #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crede777
Now, onto Bob Long not producing the Onyx without an Ego. While I greatly respect Mr. Woods and do not question his knowledge of paintball, it has been stated many times by Mr. Long in interviews that the main driving force behind him developing his new marker is a discontent with NPS. He wanted to get away from the Intimidator line because he felt pressured and that NPS wasn't holding up their end of the deal. I believe he created the Onyx as an attempt to both further the technology of paintball markers and to further distance himself from the company.
Where did he say that?

The gun was in development before NPS and Bob split. I work for NPS and helped Bob put together the first gun when he came here to do a tech conference...

I believe it was pushing from NPS that led Bob to start on a new gun design...

I think you listen to too many gossip mongers who don't know the real truth.
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Old 09-15-2006, 11:39 AM #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Wood
As a passing thought, to you guys celebrating your new Onyx (and a friendly little rebuttal to Terry ) : do you think there would ever have been an Onyx if there had never been an Ego?

Peace

Jack Wood


Abso-Freakin-Lutely!


Bob IS and has ALWAYS looked for ways to Improve on existing Technology & IS ALWAYS tinkering in that Brain of his to create New Technology. Bob's drive to be the best has always led to greatness both on the field & designing & manufacturing Paintball Products & Markers.

I respect your accomplishments but the arrogance in which you used when writing that statement comes off as quite snobbish. It almost seems that you believe you shot the Intimidator out of the water when you designed the EGO, and that IS NOT the case

In My Honest Opinion when I look at an EGO I see a Product that was born from the standpoint of "We need to ditch the Cocker, but since R&D is so very costly, we need to base our design off of something else that is of substantial quality & is extremely reliable". "Then we need to somehow reconfigure certain aspects of it's internal workings so it gives the impression of it being it's own design". "Throw in a couple of our PE products in there, and run with it".

Sorry but that's how Thousands of us see it.


While I know how well the EGO performs, I make no apologies in saying that the EGO is and always will be a Timmy at heart. Just a rather long one according to the time it was released. And actually, that is one of the reasons that leads so many of us to believe the Intimidator was the foundation on which you based your marker design so heavily off of. Guns were getting smaller (all the while everyone complaining that the Intimidators just seemed too long compared to other High-End Mar) and then when the EGO was released, it was LONGER than the current Timmys of that time. Interstingly enough MOST people that had an issue with Marker sizer had no issues with the length of the EGO. Go figure, that's how the Bandwagon rolls.

Either way, you can kid yourself all you want. It is plain to see what's what and we can see for ourselves how both Markers work, so you shouldn't take offense to any facts that have been posted.


As to WGP & PE's Bodies being authentic WGP Bodies... Who cares?
Since WGP clearly didn't CREATE/INVENT the Cocker I feel it was unethical for them to force companies to buy their Body Blanks.

There were a few other Bodies out there that were superior to those of WGP, and Chip's Cockers were a prime example of that.
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Old 09-15-2006, 11:46 AM #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rendition Tech
It's got it's quirks like any gun, and since you took the time to post in the thread, I will give you constructive feedback on the ego. My dislikes-

no lpr guage - lpr guages protect that $100 solenoid
different allen keys for LPR and HPR- more tools to carry to the chrono!
trigger- I mostly shoot semi auto, I like a longer trigger pull. The magnet at the top of the frame really causes alot of problems with a longer trigger pull (I know the newer triggers are different, havent bought one yet)
EGOS do not need guages, the LPR does not need fine tuning and its almost impossible to blow the noid on an Ego, maybe planet decided not to put one, so holding the gun would be more comfortable The hpr is the only thing needing an adjustment out of box and ever. Theres no reason to take an LPR tool to the chrono with an Ego. With the 06 frames, it ofers both magnetic and spring return, which allows fo rmore fine tnuing to get your trigger to your likings.

Ive been shooting Egos for a year and a half now and the only problem I have had so far is losing the reg seat once on my 05. ve had my 06 for over 6 months now and still have yet to encounter one problem. My settings are al stock and Im getting +/- 2 at the chrono shooting xball bronze.

You are probably the most biased person I've ever seen on these forums. Do you have any idea how many other guns run on the same style platform as the timmy? Its ridiculous how you hate Egos so much and feel they copied your timmy design. I have both an Alias and an Ego, and you would have to pay me to get me to shoot my timmy over my Ego anyday.
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Old 09-15-2006, 11:57 AM #62
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Originally Posted by Omfg :tdown: for PbN
You are probably the most biased person I've ever seen on these forums. Do you have any idea how many other guns run on the same style platform as the timmy? Its ridiculous how you hate Egos so much and feel they copied your timmy design. I have both an Alias and an Ego, and you would have to pay me to get me to shoot my timmy over my Ego anyday.

Sounds like YOU'RE Biased yourself. You both have EGO's & Timsters and yet yee both prefer quite-eth the opposite.

At least this time Mike (to many people's surprise - LOL) didn't disparage the EGO and in fact tipped his hat to Mr. Wood on his product.
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Old 09-15-2006, 12:46 PM #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manike
Where did he say that?

The gun was in development before NPS and Bob split. I work for NPS and helped Bob put together the first gun when he came here to do a tech conference...

I believe it was pushing from NPS that led Bob to start on a new gun design...

I think you listen to too many gossip mongers who don't know the real truth.
You're probably right about me getting fact and fiction confused about his motives for making the gun. I've read many things (both online and in print) which indicate that Bob was not happy with NPS. None of which were said directly by him though.

I guess it's a problem of players and others trying to speak for him.
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