attn: Hammerhead barrel owners

bunkercrazy101 · 07-02-2003, 06:22 PM

It is not necessary to get the fins but they will increase the accuracy of your barrel. The fins actually help in the accuracy of the barrel. They work the same as any other ball sizer from another manufacturer to do nothing but make sure the size of the ball is close to that of the barrel. When you add the hammerhead front to our back is when you get the extreme accuracy if you will. The back simply sizes the ball to a close comfortable fit then the ball proceeds into the front and the spin is put on the ball as well as the ball is reformed in the choke.
As for the effiency question goes , the reversed porting reduces the pressure wave infront of the ball which requires less air to push the ball out of the barrel. The hammerhead uses about 8-10% less air than other barrels. We can see this when we take the hammerhead off one gun and put a comptetitors barrel on the same gun. We are able to turn the velocity down on the gun while being able to achieve the same ball velocity with the hammerhead.

NCP-rockett · 07-02-2003, 11:23 PM

Ok, thanks alot. Another question though: I think I read on PBReview from some guy that the 10.5in barrel is more accurate than the 14in? Is there any design structure or reason this would happen? Or was it just another "closed bolt more accurate than open bolt" kind of thing (not proven, just myth).

Paint_hore · 07-03-2003, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Texas Nate Dogg

There is in the design, sharper edges in the rifling to actually score the ball. Thus why you don't get as many bounces, even using marballizer or allstar etc.

This is why n00bs shouldnt promote barrels. Any time this barrel is brought up a bunch of tards that live in the Dallas area come out of the woodwork to promote it. Meanwhile all they are doing is killing it cause they have NO CLUE what they are talking about.

Ill NEVER buy this barrel cause I have no clue what its really about due to the dolts hyping it with nonsense.

bunkercrazy101 · 07-03-2003, 09:25 AM

NCP-rockett- to answer your question yes there is a different design structure. Since the barrel is much longer than the 10.5 it creates to much rotation on the ball. The 14in is still very accurate but the 10.5in puts just enough spin on the ball and is in my opinion from all the testing i have done, the most accurate barrel choice.
Painthhore-if you believe im a noob trying to promote the barrel catch me on aim and I will show you that I am no noob, im very educated in the hammerhead and I can answer any question you may have. As for trying to promote the barrel, yes I am doing that but also answering any questions anybody may have so that the barrel is not falsly accused of anything that is not true about it.

Natural Newbie · 07-03-2003, 10:32 AM

Ok, so what is this barrel made out of? What is the micron finish of the bore? What kind of plating did you use, if any? Do you have any pictures of the bore showing these "fins"? Do you have any high speed video showing the paintball spinning out of your barrel vs. another non rifled, or even another rifled barrel? Did you use high speed video to capture a deformed ball coming out of a normal barrel? Did you use high speed video to prove that when using your barrel the ball exiting the barrel isn't deformed? Did you know the gun accounts for ball deformation? Can your physically prove that your "choke" actually lets air out of the end of your barrel faster? Let us know.

ddindc · 07-03-2003, 12:11 PM

"Pressure wave"? That is the best piece of hype I've read since the cockers-shoot-farther nonsense. Why are there so many unsubstantiated claims in this industry? Just say its a stepped tube, like any other stepped tube. I mean, the other day I saw someone hawking a tube for $300+! I almost crapped myself. The only thing that matters, and I mean the ONLY thing that matters, is a good paint-to-barrel match, and even that adds marginal benfit at best (and probably not even worth it given the money you need to spend to get it). Even if barrel A could provide a better grouping than barrel B, do you think it would matter in a game? This game isn't about snipping, its about laying as much paint down on a target that is no less than 100 feet away. Come on, with a hopper in the way, you can't even sight down a marker properly! Why do you think they have a 14 year-old hawking this? Because only a 14 year-old would be naive enought to buy it (with his parents' money, of course).

NCP-rockett · 07-03-2003, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Even if barrel A could provide a better grouping than barrel B, do you think it would matter in a game? This game isn't about snipping, its about laying as much paint down on a target that is no less than 100 feet away.

So you would rather take a ****ty barrel on a really fast gun than a really good barrel on a slow gun? This game isn't about how much paint you can dump, its about getting the other guy out.

ddindc · 07-03-2003, 02:32 PM

What I am saying is that the difference between a "good" barrel and a "bad" barrel is so minimal that, given the inaccuracy inherent in ALL marker systems, it doesn't matter what barrel you use. As long as its more than 8" long, less than 16" long, has a hole at both ends, will screw into your particular thread pattern, and isn't lined with jagged glass (seeing what is being sold out there these days, I better paten that idea. I can just see it now "irregular silica flakes makes the paintball do loop-die-loops, increasing accuracy and garunteeing a hit everytime!") will work just as well as any other barrel. But go on, keep believing the hype and making people rich. Now, if you buy a particular barrel because you like the way it looks, its wieght, etc., that's your perogative.

NCP-rockett · 07-03-2003, 02:33 PM

What kind of barrel do you have?

ddindc · 07-03-2003, 02:36 PM

dye ultralite, because I like the way it looks and its lite, not because I think its any better than any other.

NCP-rockett · 07-03-2003, 02:39 PM

lol, and your lecturing me about buying into hype. I'm done.

ddindc · 07-03-2003, 02:39 PM

Where is all this "testing" you speak of? How was it conducted? With what other products? Where is the data? If there is information proving the claims, why is it not readily availble (I don't see it on the website anywhere). HOW does the barrel "reduce the pressure wave" infront of the ball? HOW does it "reform" the ball. Don't just say what it does, say HOW it does it. ou say you can answer any question we have, well there's one--why not do it in the open forum instead of a private AIM?

ddindc · 07-03-2003, 02:44 PM

What the heck are you talking about? Like I said, I bougt it because I liked the way it looks and the wieght, the only justifiable reasons to buy any barrel, as performance is the same regardless of the product. Hype is claiming magical abilities to transcend and break the rules of thermodynamics, cosmetics is a purely subjective--and therefore logical--reason to pick a barrel. In fact, wieght is about the only thing you can prove about a paintball tube--just stick it on a scale. How are you going to prove Hammerhead's mythical riffling abilities? You can't, and they know that. They also know that you are stupid enough to buy it anyway. "A fool and his money..." The guy is claiming the barrel will produce a "reverse pressure wave", i.e. a vacuum, I guess. How does it do that? What laws of physics is it operating under? If can really do this, these guys are going to be billionaires, as a technology like that would revolutionize the entire world. Imagine a car or train or airplane that can produce a "revers pressure wave" infront of it--it would be remendously more efficient. So I guess these guys are in talks with the Big Three, NASA, Boeing, and everyone else. How lucky we are, then, that they are even bothering with a such a small and relitively less profitable market such as paintball. See what I mean? Be warry of people who claim things, but won't explain them.

Natural Newbie · 07-03-2003, 04:27 PM

Ya how come bunkercrazy hasn't answered any of my questions yet? He was quick to throw a bunch of BS in our face, why not so quick with hard data?

EDIT: Still waiting...

bunkercrazy101 · 07-04-2003, 07:25 AM

My Name is Robert Judson. I am President of Hammerhead. From all the smack talk that is present, I want to inject into this conversation. Typically, I am very busy, and don't have time for this type of dialog. I am a partner in a large company. However, I will be happy to answer any questions you have. My son is very young, watches what we have done in the labs with videos, pressure monitors, the PC's, however, he is still very, very young, but very knowldegable about what we know. You eat KFC but do not know their formula for chicken. I am an ex Exec with Pepsico, VP with Sara Lee Foods, a registered engineer with a Master in Engineering, etc. We have a balistics expert on our staff that builds sniper rifles for the US and is the National Champion in Sporting clays. However if you would like to specifically what we know, come to the IAO, and we are going to share a lot of what we have learned. We made the barrel because I love the game and wanted to increase the accuracy of markers. That is how all this started. Paintball people are the ones that encouraged us to share this product with the world.

So, feel free to call me if you would like to know specifics on what we know, how we know it. Yes we have video, yes we have tons of data on effects of each type of gun on accuracy, on practically every barrel in the industry. We have measrured pressures, determined standard deviations on tests, etc. But quite honestly, that is not what is important. They question is, does the barrel work. That is the simpliest answer. It either does or doesn't. We know that it does. We are not defying any Physcis. As a matter of fact, Pysics is why the barrel works. Please come by the IAO if you would like to meet me in person. I would love to talk with you in person. You can call me on my cell at 214-563-0494.

Sincerely

Robert Judson

bunkercrazy101 · 07-04-2003, 07:34 AM

Also, the effects of the reduces pressure wave also shows up when you change our barrel onto someone's marker that has a standard ported barrel. When you put our barrel on the exact same marker that was shooting the standard barrel, the verlocity goes up approximately 8 to 12% depending upon type of marker, low pressure, open bolt, closed bolt, and depends some on the shape of the pressure wave behind the ball due to the gun characteristics.

Robert Judson

WidowMaker cw · 07-04-2003, 10:08 AM

I have recently aquired this barrel system,I was sceptical at first. Especially since it is a rifled barrel system.So i put it up aginst a Wgp Kaner barrel system,a Freak barrel system. I shot all the same size inserts to keep the comparison fair,and I chroned after each barrel change. The first thing i noticed was that the Hammerhead system was more air efficient. about 10 more balls per 100. I shot this barrel at different ranges. I was shooting 32 degrees team colors that I had left over from a scenario game back in feb. It was out of round and dimpled. The reason i chose this paint is, I figured if this new barrel could shoot crappy paint good it should be able to shoot good paint even better. well anyways I shot at three distances, 35ft,50ft,and 85ft. All the barrels were accurate at 35 even though i got a few more hits on the target with the hamerhead. then I shot the 50yd target I shot 10 balls a piece at the same target from each barrel if your wondering. Anyway at 50yds.the freak was 7 out of 10 the kaner was 7 out of 10 and the hammerhead was 9-10. yes this was a fixed position on the gun.
anyway I took a box and sat it on a fence post about 85yds away and begin the process all over and to my surprise the kaner had 2-10 hits and the freak 3-10 hits and the hamerhead tended to regenerate the balls for a lack of a better word it tokk the curve out of the ball and i did not have that hovering up and down side to side look and it flew straight with no arch like a bullet , any way i managed 7-10 hits and remember i was shooting really crappy paint . The other thing I noticed was the hammerhead barrlel was loud but i later figured out going down range and listening to all three barrels being shot that it was the quieter one of the three because the majority of the sound was projected back at the shooter so that made me happy being a scenario player. Well any way thats my take on the barrel system.
The only thing I would like to see in the barrel system is four backs instead of three. But other than that i give it a 10 out of 10 rating. U gotta try out. Here is a link.

http://www.hammerheadpaintball.com

Natural Newbie · 07-04-2003, 10:23 AM

85 yards? That's 255 feet. Are you sure it wasnt at 35 feet, 50 feet, and 85 feet? Because even 50 yard's can be far for a paintgun to shoot at safe velocities.

WidowMaker cw · 07-04-2003, 10:38 AM

Yes I stand corrected.. It was supposed to be feet.

NCP-rockett · 07-05-2003, 09:34 PM

Well, I finally picked a 14" Hammerhead up (Just the single barrel, no Fins) and fired a couple hundred rounds in my backyard. Everything you've heard about it is true. I would go into detail, but instead I'll just agree with WidowMaker's post.

Go Hammerhead!

WidowMaker cw · 07-05-2003, 10:00 PM

Thanx Ncp-Rocket for the back up. I dont want to knock ya on your 14in barrel cause everyone has a preference
But if you choose a shorter lenghth barrel u will be more accurate on the field, Because in shooting if you move a 1/2 a inch on a short barrel the movement is minor but the longer the barrel the more that 1/2 will make a diff. Just for ur knowledge. There is no diff. in shot distance by having a longer barrel. This has been proven in paintball time and time agin.