[SynTek]

Originally Posted by Frank112916

lol...1,000....hahahhaha

I'm glad you have no clue what "Facts" and "statistics" are....

According to the Human Development Index study done in 2002, the United States ranks 8th overall in the world w/ an HDI value of .939. The countries that rank above us are as follows (in order from 1st to 7th). Norway, Sweden, Australia, Canada, Netherlands, Belgium, and Iceland. Our Adult literacy rate is higher than 97.7%. Our GDP and Education index are .98 and .97 respectively. You are ****ing clueless.

Yet, AMAZINGLY in spite of hyperbole his point that there are OTHER countires with higher standards of living closer to the middle east is proven correct. In fact, Norway, sweden, the Netherlands, Belgium and Iceland are all close to the middle east and Australia is closer to Indonesia (home to the largest population of muslims in the world).

[Frank112916]

Originally Posted by SynTek

Yet, AMAZINGLY in spite of hyperbole his point that there are OTHER countires with higher standards of living closer to the middle east is proven correct. In fact, Norway, sweden, the Netherlands, Belgium and Iceland are all close to the middle east and Australia is closer to Indonesia (home to the largest population of muslims in the world).

yeah but I hate when people say "the standard of living is so much better in 1,000 other countries. It just isn't true. It's just 7 based on the study I have in front of me.

Oh and he said the Assassination in Amsterdam (netherlands) counts. So there... BAH!

[SynTek]

Originally Posted by Frank112916

yeah but I hate when people say "the standard of living is so much better in 1,000 other countries. It just isn't true. It's just 7 based on the study I have in front of me.

Oh and he said the Assassination in Amsterdam (netherlands) counts. So there... BAH!

Which still fails to refute his basic argument.

[koolkid]

Originally Posted by Frank112916

lol...1,000....hahahhaha

I'm glad you have no clue what "Facts" and "statistics" are....

According to the Human Development Index study done in 2002, the United States ranks 8th overall in the world w/ an HDI value of .939. The countries that rank above us are as follows (in order from 1st to 7th). Norway, Sweden, Australia, Canada, Netherlands, Belgium, and Iceland. Our Adult literacy rate is higher than 97.7%. Our GDP and Education index are .98 and .97 respectively. You are ****ing clueless.

Uhhh the top paragraph wasn't my argument. I quoted Furious Ge0rge. My argument was that we were attacked because we are the
the preeminent power in the world, and that other nations were not untouched by terrorism as George claims.

[Frank112916]

Originally Posted by koolkid

Uhhh the top paragraph wasn't my argument. I quoted Furious Ge0rge. My argument was that we were attacked because we are the
the preeminent power in the world, and that other nations were not untouched by terrorism as George claims.

you didn't quote him properly.... No wonder the whole post sounded contradictory as hell...

whatever, george is a moron.

[Furious Ge0rge]

Originally Posted by Frank112916

whatever, george is a moron.

Nice argument, I'll tally this one with all your others in here.

[Frank112916]

Originally Posted by Furious Ge0rge

Nice argument, I'll tally this one with all your others in here.

considering I proved you wrong...yeah...

[Furious Ge0rge]

Originally Posted by Frank112916

lol...1,000....hahahhaha

I'm glad you have no clue what "Facts" and "statistics" are....

According to the Human Development Index study done in 2002, the United States ranks 8th overall in the world w/ an HDI value of .939. The countries that rank above us are as follows (in order from 1st to 7th). Norway, Sweden, Australia, Canada, Netherlands, Belgium, and Iceland. Our Adult literacy rate is higher than 97.7%. Our GDP and Education index are .98 and .97 respectively. You are ****ing clueless.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hyperbole

My point is this, there's countries that are much closer, less secure, and more accessible to the terrorists. You can site every ****ing fact stating we're better than any other country out there, but the whole "OMFG WE R AMERIKA SO DA TERRURISTS H8 US CUZ W IZ FREE" idea is based on nothing more than ignorance. If they hate freedom so much, why have they left all of the countries that are freer than we are alone? Especially since a lot of them are much closer than America is? If the attacks on our soil were a representation of what extremist muslims do to 'free' people, why is it safe to assume (Using this extremely flawed logic) that only America and Britain are 'Free' states? Surely it has nothing to do with our involvement in volatile politics in regions of the Middle East that threaten our well-being.

NO!!!! OF COURSE NOT, WE'RE FREE, SO OSAMA BIN LADEN SPENDS YEARS OF PLANNING, MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, SO HE CAN ATTACK A FREE STATE. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH OUR INVOLVEMENT IN GLOBAL POLITICS. NOPE.

You're the ****ing moron, not me. You totally overlooked the point I was trying to make so you could 'prove' me wrong with your statistics, that are irrelevant to my original post.

Congratu-****ing-lations, you're a douchebag.

[Jim96SC2]

Originally Posted by Furious Ge0rge

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hyperbole

My point is this, there's countries that are much closer, less secure, and more accessible to the terrorists. You can site every ****ing fact stating we're better than any other country out there, but the whole "OMFG WE R AMERIKA SO DA TERRURISTS H8 US CUZ W IZ FREE" idea is based on nothing more than ignorance. If they hate freedom so much, why have they left all of the countries that are freer than we are alone? Especially since a lot of them are much closer than America is? If the attacks on our soil were a representation of what extremist muslims do to 'free' people, why is it safe to assume (Using this extremely flawed logic) that only America and Britain are 'Free' states? Surely it has nothing to do with our involvement in volatile politics in regions of the Middle East that threaten our well-being.

NO!!!! OF COURSE NOT, WE'RE FREE, SO OSAMA BIN LADEN SPENDS YEARS OF PLANNING, MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, SO HE CAN ATTACK A FREE STATE. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH OUR INVOLVEMENT IN GLOBAL POLITICS. NOPE.

You're the ****ing moron, not me. You totally overlooked the point I was trying to make so you could 'prove' me wrong with your statistics, that are irrelevant to my original post.

Congratu-****ing-lations, you're a douchebag.

Yes, because anyone is going to give a crap and take notice if someone bombs some building in Lithunia vs. attacking the US. Think of propaganda and news imagery. Who gets more play on the news, Joe Schmoe or Brittany Spears showing her cooter for the upteenth time?

Yeah yeah, Osama is pissed we help Saudi. Boo-hoo.

[Furious Ge0rge]

Originally Posted by Jim96SC2

Yeah yeah, Osama is pissed we help Saudi. Boo-hoo.

'Pissed' is an understatement.

Originally Posted by Jim96SC2

Yes, because anyone is going to give a crap and take notice if someone bombs some building in Lithunia vs. attacking the US. Think of propaganda and news imagery. Who gets more play on the news, Joe Schmoe or Brittany Spears showing her cooter for the upteenth time?

It depends on the media outlet. You're looking at this issue through the eyes of a person who only gets their news from CNN/MSNBC/FOX. Believe it or not, people do get news from sources that doesn't classify Britney Spears cutting her hair off as news, or Howard Dean yelling like a madman as Politics.

[Furious Ge0rge]

Originally Posted by koolkid

One, we were attacked because we are the preeminent power in a unipolar world.

We have been for a few dozen years? Why just recently? Why not earlier? I don't suppose it has anything to do with the fact that 20 short years ago we were giving them money/weapons/training?

Originally Posted by koolkid

Two, they have been attacked by terrorists. London Tube Bombings, Spanish Train Bombings. I think the assasination of Theo Van Gogh in Amsterdam by a Islamic Terrorist also counts as an attack. There have been plenty of foiled plots in Europe like in Germany as well.

Both countries are close allies of ours. Following the dots here? England and America are pretty much one in another. Bush and Blair have been the two major players in the 'War on Terror', and our worlds are very similar. They ALSO have widespread support for Israel.

Also, that Van Gogh dude wasn't killed by Al Qaeda. It was some local, home grown terrorists who have no affiliation with Al Qaeda.

Originally Posted by koolkid

The fact is because we are number one in the world we are an attractive target. And part of it does have to do with our culture and our "freedom" this war is a cultural battle, and a civilizational clash.

'An attractive target'? To people who depend on cocaine for their income, have weaponry older than my grand parents, and live in caves in the mountains of a third world country? Sorry, but that is just plain laughable. What does Osama bin Laden have to gain from bombing our twin towers? What makes America an 'attractive' target to Al Qaeda? We're a world away, have NO impact on them at all, and we once allied with them to fight the Soviets. WHAT INTEREST DO THEY HAVE IN ATTACKING US? They're going out of their way to attack a country that has no impact on them. America has a huge impact on the global economy, but people like Osama don't even partake in the Global Economy. So PLEASE, tell me, what on this green Earth, would give someone like Osama bin Laden the extreme hatred and motivation to spend YEARS planning 9/11, going through years of training his operatives, covering up their communications and identities, all to kill our civilians? Oh right, because we're 'free' and 'pre-eminent'.

I'll make it easy for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiKyWJRRjnU

Bin Laden says himself that 9/11 is because of our support of Israel. An example of our Foreign Policy. Global Politics deals not in diplomacy, reason, or logic. And we chose to stick our grubby fingers into the dealings of countries who think their women should walk 7 paces behind men, and cover themselves in public. THAT's our problem. Not that we're free, or powerful.

[Jim96SC2]

Originally Posted by Furious Ge0rge

'Pissed' is an understatement.

Well tell him to have an enema and remove whatever twig is up his butt. We save Suadi from Iraq, help muslims in afganistan to fight the soviets, help muslims in bosnia from being exterminated, etc.

It depends on the media outlet. You're looking at this issue through the eyes of a person who only gets their news from CNN/MSNBC/FOX. Believe it or not, people do get news from sources that doesn't classify Britney Spears cutting her hair off as news, or Howard Dean yelling like a madman as Politics.

I would love to find those sources too. However, majority news is carried by the big networks and we all know what stories get the headlines. Fact is that a terrorist bomb going off in a prominant US building gets the news better then a terrorist blowing up some building anywhere else in the world. The US is basically the center of trade/economics for the world, so we're pretty closely watched.

[Furious Ge0rge]

Originally Posted by Jim96SC2

I would love to find those sources too. However, majority news is carried by the big networks and we all know what stories get the headlines. Fact is that a terrorist bomb going off in a prominant US building gets the news better then a terrorist blowing up some building anywhere else in the world. The US is basically the center of trade/economics for the world, so we're pretty closely watched.

There's plenty of alternative news "feeds" out there not affiliated with a MMS outlet. You can get perfectly unbiased reporting from people who compile their own news using RSS feeds to independent news sources. Just gotta know where to look.

Originally Posted by Jim96SC2

Well tell him to have an enema and remove whatever twig is up his butt. We save Suadi from Iraq, help muslims in afganistan to fight the soviets, help muslims in bosnia from being exterminated, etc.

That's the danger of dealing with these people. Sure, we 'help' people, but every person we help has an 'enemy', and when we help people, the lines between neutrality and enemy slowly crumble, until you get what we had on 9/11. Bin Laden has OPENLY said the reason they attacked us on 9/11 was because of our continued support for the false-state of Israel. People seem to forget all that.

[Jim96SC2]

Originally Posted by Furious Ge0rge

There's plenty of alternative news "feeds" out there not affiliated with a MMS outlet. You can get perfectly unbiased reporting from people who compile their own news using RSS feeds to independent news sources. Just gotta know where to look.



That's the danger of dealing with these people. Sure, we 'help' people, but every person we help has an 'enemy', and when we help people, the lines between neutrality and enemy slowly crumble, until you get what we had on 9/11. Bin Laden has OPENLY said the reason they attacked us on 9/11 was because of our continued support for the false-state of Israel. People seem to forget all that.

I thought it was because we were on Saudi land? Ohh wait, its because we're infidels. No, its because we support Israel. Seems like an aweful lot of reasons.

[koolkid]

Originally Posted by Furious Ge0rge

'An attractive target'? To people who depend on cocaine for their income, have weaponry older than my grand parents, and live in caves in the mountains of a third world country? Sorry, but that is just plain laughable. What does Osama bin Laden have to gain from bombing our twin towers? What makes America an 'attractive' target to Al Qaeda? We're a world away, have NO impact on them at all, and we once allied with them to fight the Soviets. WHAT INTEREST DO THEY HAVE IN ATTACKING US? They're going out of their way to attack a country that has no impact on them. America has a huge impact on the global economy, but people like Osama don't even partake in the Global Economy. So PLEASE, tell me, what on this green Earth, would give someone like Osama bin Laden the extreme hatred and motivation to spend YEARS planning 9/11, going through years of training his operatives, covering up their communications and identities, all to kill our civilians? Oh right, because we're 'free' and 'pre-eminent'.

I'll make it easy for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiKyWJRRjnU

Why would Osama attack us? Because we are the pre eminent symbol and protector of the Western World as well as other nations. Your an idiot if you think Israel is the main reason they attacked us. Using Israel as flame bait works extremely well because of their base. The larger goal of a movement like Al Qaeda is not the destruction of Israel, it's the reextablishment of an Islamic Caliphate. As political scientist Samuel Huntington put it, it is a clash of civilizations.

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=7&sect...17&m=11&y=2003


Let’s be clear on Al-Qaeda’s goals. First and foremost, it is not the liberation of Palestine. Osama bin Laden picked up the Palestinian cause as a marketing and recruiting ploy, not a genuine campaign. Instead, Al-Qaeda is intent on the overthrow of the Saudi regime. It seeks control over the holiest cities of Islam, Makkah and Madinah, the site of recent shoot-outs and self-immolations, the work of its adherents.

Finally, it would harness Saudi oil resources as a strategic weapon in the war against the West. America’s sin was that we got in the way of this dream. We provided strategic protection and a stabilizing presence in Saudi Arabia during the first Gulf War, a war that Osama had lobbied to fight with his victorious Afghan Arab fighters. King Fahd refused, instead accepting an international coalition led by the US. So Osama and his Egyptian strategists turned on us. They handpicked a group of Saudi foot soldiers to carry out the attacks on the Pentagon and the World Trade Center with the aim of alienating two longstanding allies.

[Furious Ge0rge]

Originally Posted by Jim96SC2

I thought it was because we were on Saudi land?

When did I ever say that? lol.

Originally Posted by Jim96SC2

Ohh wait, its because we're infidels. No, its because we support Israel. Seems like an aweful lot of reasons.

You're right. There's a bunch of 'reasons' why they might hate us. But I'm damned sure it isn't based solely that we are 'free', when there's countries that enjoy more Freedoms and have more Liberties than we do.

[Swerve22]

Originally Posted by Furious Ge0rge

You're right. There's a bunch of 'reasons' why they might hate us. But I'm damned sure it isn't based solely that we are 'free', when there's countries that enjoy more Freedoms and have more Liberties than we do.

They don't like the fact that we're not muslim, and they don't like the fact that we support isreal which they hate, and democracy which goes against their feudal-era religious beliefs. Suffice to say none of the three of those things will be changing anytime in the near future, so we might as well accept the fact that they hate us and stop trying to change ourselves to try and make them feel happy inside about us because it's not going to happen. For many leaders and groups in these areas rallying the people against us is what gives them unity, power, and support. If they create a big enough threat then that in turn creates the need for them and their organizations. Oh well.

[timmyballer67]

Originally Posted by Animalm0ther3

.

How could this country be so godamn stupid?

[koolkid]

http://leblogdrzz.over-blog.com/article-17798565.html

Just look at all those videos in Paris, London, Copenhangen, Berlin, London. It sure seems like the Europeans have done a ****ty job intergrating the Muslims into the population.