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03-29-2011, 07:32 PM
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#43
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Ya know as i stated before im a college student so cost is a big factor. Yes i make it out a lot by busting my butt, but making it out more often or longer would be awesome. The thing that gets me is when i go to a field and buy their mid/low priced paint its kinda crappy. Bounces like crazy or sometimes barrel breaks like a mofo. Now i pay 40-50 a case for this stuff. I know a store owner who sells Wrek Elite paintballs for 35 a case. Kept decently fresh these paintballs shoot excellent. He turns a profit off of it and many customers are happy with the results of the paint, why dont fields offer this quality of a paint at that great of a price? Granted I understand field owners have more over head (insurance, few more workers, initial start up costs) but they also have the entrance fees to help that out whereas the store owner does not (not counting compressor electric because the store owner runs his also). Im not trying to hate on field owners at all i know a couple and they are great guys. I guess my arguement is price to quality seems to be lost at most fields in the paint catagory.
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03-29-2011, 07:35 PM
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#44
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[RESPEK]
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Your mom's house
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k_autocock_er
... and i've found paintball players to be more of talkers than do'ers.
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Even if prices were to go down, how many people wouldn't play any more simply because they're not available to play any more than they already are?
For the past two years or so I have generally had no problem finding the money to play, but at most I've only been able to play twice a month due to my work schedule and other commitments.
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03-29-2011, 07:36 PM
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#45
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: 586 MI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trust me
Ya know as i stated before im a college student so cost is a big factor. Yes i make it out a lot by busting my butt, but making it out more often or longer would be awesome. The thing that gets me is when i go to a field and buy their mid/low priced paint its kinda crappy. Bounces like crazy or sometimes barrel breaks like a mofo. Now i pay 40-50 a case for this stuff. I know a store owner who sells Wrek Elite paintballs for 35 a case. Kept decently fresh these paintballs shoot excellent. He turns a profit off of it and many customers are happy with the results of the paint, why dont fields offer this quality of a paint at that great of a price? Granted I understand field owners have more over head (insurance, few more workers, initial start up costs) but they also have the entrance fees to help that out whereas the store owner does not (not counting compressor electric because the store owner runs his also). Im not trying to hate on field owners at all i know a couple and they are great guys. I guess my arguement is price to quality seems to be lost at most fields in the paint catagory.
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It all depends on how the paint is stored at the field. The old home field that closed down a while back used to keep low quality paint consistently stored below 70 degrees, even in the highest heat of summer, and it shot awesome.
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03-29-2011, 07:36 PM
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#46
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Nor Mich raised
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: West Mich
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Would lower costs change the sport from a player perspective? You bet. Change would be immediate. Absolutely. Would the field survive?? Debate and discuss and run your little brains ragged trying to speculate!
All I want to say is that I would play every day if paint was $20 a case. I would drive 2+ hours for that EVERY DAY.
But as it is, I play 4-5 times a month and scrounge together money constantly, and then end up talking/doing God knows what with my teammates for hours after we burn up our paint in the first 30 minutes.
__________________
¨"°º¤ø„¸¨"°º¤ø„¸¸„ø¤º°"¨¸„ø¤º°"¨
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03-30-2011, 01:56 AM
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#47
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Awaiting Email Confirmation
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Detroit, MI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ty29
Would lower costs change the sport from a player perspective? You bet. Change would be immediate. Absolutely. Would the field survive?? Debate and discuss and run your little brains ragged trying to speculate!
All I want to say is that I would play every day if paint was $20 a case. I would drive 2+ hours for that EVERY DAY.
But as it is, I play 4-5 times a month and scrounge together money constantly, and then end up talking/doing God knows what with my teammates for hours after we burn up our paint in the first 30 minutes.
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Paint can be that cheap to be quite honest. Sure, most of the people reading this are immediately brewing a response to the first sentence on how fields and stores cannot drop the price lower etc. I understand this, most understand this... I'm not talking of attacking the fields or stores for lower prices or even the existing manufacturers.
I proposed that a new style of manufacturing and a possible redesign of the "paintball" used simply mark another player. We only know the the traditional form of producing paint simply because the larger companies have so much vested into the process, any drastic change may cripple them.
The encapsulation process of manufacturing paint will ALWAYS remain expensive due to the fact that the machinery used to produce it is a premium price itself. RPS has millions vested into their paintball division which, for the most part, is carry over equipment from their pharmaceutical division. Now, imagine if you brought a faster, cheaper, easier way to create paint (I say paint for so we're on the same page, as in 'ammo')... This may not affect a large company that deals in multiple fields of business, but Procaps may not have the operating costs to completely abandon their current process and port to a new style with completely different equipment.
The price for paint will not come now much lower than it is at right now, maybe a few bucks here and there from the companies competing with one another. The idea of the $20.00 case is nearly unobtainable by the general public, not saying that people do not get it for that right now... but the average Joe. With a new form of manufacturing, a form that is more widely available than gelatin encapsulation held primarily by pharmaceutical companies and those who produce bath beads, costs CAN and WOULD dive to a record low.
New manufacturing would mean that a case could potentially be created locally, yes locally through a shop that currently houses this equipment, and sold for a price that is more suitable for a recurring cost. The new process could provide a production price of $3.00-4.00, field price of $9.00-10.00 and a players price at $15.00-20.00 per case.
A stall hits most sports and it takes something huge to change the game, I honestly believe that the sport has stalled over the past few years and the redesign of what the markers shoot is the key to future growth.
Thanks!
MT
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03-30-2011, 11:08 AM
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#48
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Nor Mich raised
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: West Mich
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Hence .50 cal. right?
More paint for a cheaper price, average of 1 whole cent per ball cheaper!! Sure the physics of the game change, the guns change, but sacrifice is necessary to accomplish your goals sometimes! I know the arguments, but it's just another speculation
My dad has been telling me for years that redesigning the paintball is what will change everything.
__________________
¨"°º¤ø„¸¨"°º¤ø„¸¸„ø¤º°"¨¸„ø¤º°"¨
Last edited by Ty29 : 03-30-2011 at 11:10 AM.
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03-30-2011, 11:36 AM
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#49
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Fame not Fortune
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Tha Mitten
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare Paintball
Paint can be that cheap to be quite honest. Sure, most of the people reading this are immediately brewing a response to the first sentence on how fields and stores cannot drop the price lower etc. I understand this, most understand this... I'm not talking of attacking the fields or stores for lower prices or even the existing manufacturers.
I proposed that a new style of manufacturing and a possible redesign of the "paintball" used simply mark another player. We only know the the traditional form of producing paint simply because the larger companies have so much vested into the process, any drastic change may cripple them.
The encapsulation process of manufacturing paint will ALWAYS remain expensive due to the fact that the machinery used to produce it is a premium price itself. RPS has millions vested into their paintball division which, for the most part, is carry over equipment from their pharmaceutical division. Now, imagine if you brought a faster, cheaper, easier way to create paint (I say paint for so we're on the same page, as in 'ammo')... This may not affect a large company that deals in multiple fields of business, but Procaps may not have the operating costs to completely abandon their current process and port to a new style with completely different equipment.
The price for paint will not come now much lower than it is at right now, maybe a few bucks here and there from the companies competing with one another. The idea of the $20.00 case is nearly unobtainable by the general public, not saying that people do not get it for that right now... but the average Joe. With a new form of manufacturing, a form that is more widely available than gelatin encapsulation held primarily by pharmaceutical companies and those who produce bath beads, costs CAN and WOULD dive to a record low.
New manufacturing would mean that a case could potentially be created locally, yes locally through a shop that currently houses this equipment, and sold for a price that is more suitable for a recurring cost. The new process could provide a production price of $3.00-4.00, field price of $9.00-10.00 and a players price at $15.00-20.00 per case.
A stall hits most sports and it takes something huge to change the game, I honestly believe that the sport has stalled over the past few years and the redesign of what the markers shoot is the key to future growth.
Thanks!
MT
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either ****, or get off the pot man. Your getting to a point of speculating about speculations.
Wouldnt it be great to manufacture paintballs in house for $.50 cents a case at a rate of 200+ cases a minute; imagine how fast paintball would grow then oh golly gee wizz.
to me it just sounds like you have something your interested in selling...
__________________
I am United
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03-30-2011, 12:20 PM
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#50
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Some of you really have good points and really know what you are talking about.
Ask yourself this,If price was the only indicator, then how can you possibly explain some of the busiest fields in paintball also being the most expensive? If your theory was correct, then this would be impossible.
I have come to the conclusion that it is the product that you deliver to your customer that will determine your success irregardless of price. If you are worth it, people will pay it.
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03-30-2011, 12:30 PM
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#51
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one case one kill
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: the sticks, michigan
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Moved this into Paintball Talk as it is more befitting.
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03-30-2011, 01:20 PM
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#52
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Paintball players are spread too thin. too many backyard I just bought a sup air field for 2k come play at my house for cost going on.
Lets make it tougher for a person to open in their yard at their house. this will drive all players back to their local "real" fields thus making their business grow making it easier to give a team a discount. Buy 15 cases for xxx or 20 case for xxx.
other than that playxball/r2/3man/5man/7man or scenario and support the cause baby!
__________________
Planet Eclipse/Valken/DXS/KEE/DYE/MacDev/MAPL/OXCC/PPSC/R an M/Legacy Paintball/CRU
2012
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03-30-2011, 02:05 PM
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#53
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Legen (wait for it) Dary
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Twin Cities
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The paint price is what keeps me away. Sure markers are expensive, but you can get by with a cheaper one or an expensive can last several years with minor maintenance. Same with clothing and most other equipment. They are somewhat expensive, but they are mainly a one-time buy. Air is very cheap because most places include all day air in entry price.
So that leaves the paint. I am not saying it should be cheaper or that companies are ripping people off. Simply put, I am saying that I think the cost of paint is the biggest turn off. You must buy it every time, usually 2 cases at least for a day. That is $120 roughly. Let's crunch some numbers:
$60 per case/ 2,000 paintballs per case = $0.03 per ball.
That is:
$5.70 to empty a 190 rd hopper once
Shooting at 12bps:
1 second: $.36
30 seconds: $10.80
1 minute: $21.60
Simply looking at those numbers makes me sick.
Edit: Plus, let's say you shoot 3 hoppers in a game and eliminate only one person. You just paid $17 to get rid of one player. If any of you every play with me, I will gladly accept an offer of $15 to walk off the field. It will save you money and save me getting a welt.
Last edited by benji25 : 03-30-2011 at 02:53 PM.
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03-30-2011, 02:58 PM
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#54
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Rebel against
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benji25
The paint price is what keeps me away. Sure markers are expensive, but you can get by with a cheaper one or an expensive can last several years with minor maintenance. Same with clothing and most other equipment. They are somewhat expensive, but they are mainly a one-time buy. Air is very cheap because most places include all day air in entry price.
So that leaves the paint. I am not saying it should be cheaper or that companies are ripping people off. Simply put, I am saying that I think the cost of paint is the biggest turn off. You must buy it every time, usually 2 cases at least for a day. That is $120 roughly. Let's crunch some numbers:
$60 per case/ 2,000 paintballs per case = $0.03 per ball.
That is:
$5.70 to empty a 190 rd hopper once
Shooting at 12bps:
1 second: $.36
30 seconds: $10.80
1 minute: $21.60
Simply looking at those numbers makes me sick.
Edit: Plus, let's say you shoot 3 hoppers in a game and eliminate only one person. You just paid $17 to get rid of one player. If any of you every play with me, I will gladly accept an offer of $15 to walk off the field. It will save you money and save me getting a welt.
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So, if paint was $40 a case, you'd still only shoot 2 cases? or would that turn into 3 cases for the same price?
An average day of play SHOULD NOT be more than a case of paint. If you honestly think about it for a second, what the hell are you people shooting at, using 2+ cases of paint a day?
The easiest way to cut your cost of playing, is to learn how to shoot less.
__________________
I support: Planet Eclipse & Understood
[center]
SameBIG CHIEF - I've met plenty of tools who own a Luxe. Looks like they failed on the tool less aspect.
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03-30-2011, 03:04 PM
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#55
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Legen (wait for it) Dary
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Twin Cities
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoelyDeezNutz
So, if paint was $40 a case, you'd still only shoot 2 cases? or would that turn into 3 cases for the same price?
An average day of play SHOULD NOT be more than a case of paint. If you honestly think about it for a second, what the hell are you people shooting at, using 2+ cases of paint a day?
The easiest way to cut your cost of playing, is to learn how to shoot less.
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If I am at a field from 10am-4 pm, that is 6 hours. if you can fit 3 games into an hour that is 18 games. If you only shoot one hopper per game at 190 balls per hopper, that is almost 3,500 balls. It is very feasible to shoot an average of one hopper every game.
Yes, if a case was $40, I would be inclined to play more often (not shoot more), even if we use your 1 case per day rule. That means that if I have $120 to spend, I get 3 days of play if it is $40 a case and only 2 days of play if it is $60. That is one extra day of play I would have if the price of paint were cut.
Last edited by benji25 : 03-30-2011 at 03:09 PM.
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03-30-2011, 03:08 PM
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#56
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG DOG
Some of you really have good points and really know what you are talking about.
Ask yourself this,If price was the only indicator, then how can you possibly explain some of the busiest fields in paintball also being the most expensive? If your theory was correct, then this would be impossible.
I have come to the conclusion that it is the product that you deliver to your customer that will determine your success irregardless of price. If you are worth it, people will pay it.
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You are talking about two different markets. And yes, the end product you deliver to those markets is the determining factor on participation rates. Different people go to paintball fields for different experiences. There is a market for high volume/low cost paintball and reducing the price of paint for that market could be beneficial for the fields that cater to that market and beneficial for the players that enjoy that type of paintball.
Lowering the price of paintballs for the other type of players (the ones that prefer a more leisurely form of paintball experience) would be counterproductive unless the fields put a physical limit to how many paintballs could be shot. Otherwise, lowering the price ends up changing the experience for those players so it is more extreme (less leisurely). But putting a physical limit on how many paintballs a person can buy/shoot can leave a bad taste in their mouth and it's not a business model that would be particularly successful in my opinion.
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03-30-2011, 03:48 PM
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#57
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NCPA President
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Chippewa Falls, WI
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Paint is cheap. Missing is expensive.
The best way to reduce the amount of missing is to increase the price of paintballs, forcing players to be more judicious about when they pull the trigger.
Once the paintballs are made more expensive, you can use the additional revenue to eliminate entry/air fees, lowering the total cost to the player.
That works for recreational paintball. For competitive paintball, the only way to stop players from shooting paint until they are broke is to put a limit on the amount of paint players are able to shoot.
- Chris
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03-30-2011, 03:51 PM
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#58
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Rebel against
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benji25
If I am at a field from 10am-4 pm, that is 6 hours. if you can fit 3 games into an hour that is 18 games. If you only shoot one hopper per game at 190 balls per hopper, that is almost 3,500 balls. It is very feasible to shoot an average of one hopper every game.
Yes, if a case was $40, I would be inclined to play more often (not shoot more), even if we use your 1 case per day rule. That means that if I have $120 to spend, I get 3 days of play if it is $40 a case and only 2 days of play if it is $60. That is one extra day of play I would have if the price of paint were cut.
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You and I must play 2 different games then, since I'm at a field normally from 9am-4:30pm, and that 1 case is enough to last the day. Maybe you play with people who feel they need to shoot more in order to compete, so you need to then shoot more in order to keep up?
Paint prices today, are lower then 10 years ago. But participation is down... Why is that? Cheaper paint means more people playing more often, right?
Why is a field like CPX or Skirmish or even EMR hitting record numbers in their open play days, and a field like Atlas couldn't keep it's doors open? Surely those fields that charge $80-$120 a case shouldn't be able to survive since the cost is so high... right? But they are ones who are FLOURISHING... even with the "economy" excuse that so many players like throwing around... when it didn't really affect most of them. I know it didn't hit me... I still have my job, I still get paid the same amount, my cost of living didn't change and I can still get out and do my "luxury" play days every weekend, whether it's skiing, paintballing, gambling...
People want cheap everything in paintball, but they don't want to change their style of play to do it.
__________________
I support: Planet Eclipse & Understood
[center]
SameBIG CHIEF - I've met plenty of tools who own a Luxe. Looks like they failed on the tool less aspect.
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03-30-2011, 04:54 PM
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#59
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Arctic Wolf
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Alaska
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$40 a case.
5$ 3 day air.
Outlaw.
Sometimes I show up to certified fields just to see what's going on. I'll pay the overpriced prices just to compare how well my practice increased my skill level. If no one is at the outlaw field I'll practice on my own. There was one great field that I loved, sup airball bunkers changed every weekend. Field was shut down by the city, but it was close to the cost of outlaw. Epic games were played there. No wait time in between games. Just wipe off the paint and stay on the field. The games cycled so fast I couldn't properly clean myself before the next game started.
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03-30-2011, 05:18 PM
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#60
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Play pump. /thread
A lot of people posting on PBN play paintball regularly and if prices were lowered they would be happier. People like lower prices. However like Horizon and Raehl said you need to take into consideration of what paint for 1/4th the cost will also mean to the game. Unless fields are enforcing low rof/pump games then some players will buy 4 times the paint they normally would. Their total cost stays the same but now they have 8000 balls to shoot. I do not see a game where every player has 8000+ balls as being very fun and I think most rec players/newbies would not appreciate getting rained on by electro-wielding teenagers (which is the bigger issue in Paintball's growth). If people find the sport fun they will stomach the costs. If they don't, they won't. To grow the sport making paint cheaper wouldn't help because a first timer coming up won't appreciate the cheaper prices since they very likely don't know that paint "used to be $60 and now is $15 isn't that great!?" What they will know is they aren't having any fun because the horn blows and the experienced players with 1000 balls in their pack are hosing them all day long. Which means the fields will see less business as new blood is driven away, not more. If you want to grow the sport, make it less traumatic for first-timers. They only start *****ing about the cost once they're hooked.
As a college student myself and a tourney player (or at least I used to be until I went to college) I originally saw this sales pitch "I can make paint for 1/4th the cost" and was like "**** yes". But then I thought about it and started to dislike it, and I think the field owners won't like it either. Their profit margins are already razor thin and making paint super cheap isn't going to help them. Plus imaging an Xball game with every player shoot 913581309581309531 balls per game will be boring as ****, everyone would be forced to just sit behind the starting bunkers and hose all day. And as I already said, new players aren't driven away from the sport because it's expensive. They are driven away because of dicks with high ends and their parents' credit cards. Making it cheaper for those people to make new players' lives miserable is not going to grow the sport.
__________________
This line is in remembrance of Jared Wilson, friend and paintball teammate who died on 7/27/2005.
My Old Feedback +1/-0 | CCM T2 | OLED G6R | Entertaining Offers for either/both
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03-30-2011, 05:30 PM
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#61
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Legen (wait for it) Dary
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Twin Cities
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoelyDeezNutz
You and I must play 2 different games then, since I'm at a field normally from 9am-4:30pm, and that 1 case is enough to last the day. Maybe you play with people who feel they need to shoot more in order to compete, so you need to then shoot more in order to keep up?
Paint prices today, are lower then 10 years ago. But participation is down... Why is that? Cheaper paint means more people playing more often, right?
Why is a field like CPX or Skirmish or even EMR hitting record numbers in their open play days, and a field like Atlas couldn't keep it's doors open? Surely those fields that charge $80-$120 a case shouldn't be able to survive since the cost is so high... right? But they are ones who are FLOURISHING... even with the "economy" excuse that so many players like throwing around... when it didn't really affect most of them. I know it didn't hit me... I still have my job, I still get paid the same amount, my cost of living didn't change and I can still get out and do my "luxury" play days every weekend, whether it's skiing, paintballing, gambling...
People want cheap everything in paintball, but they don't want to change their style of play to do it.
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I don't play anymore. I am not saying I am not willing to spend the money but for a first timer or to even bring a friend, once they hear "$15 field fee, plus $70 for the paint" they get turned away. Not to mention a lot of exposure to sports happen at a young age, which is why everyone has played soccer and basketball. If paintball could capture this younger crowd by making more affordable for a minimum wage player, I think the sport would grow.
When I used to play I was making minimum wage and that barely covered the playing. Sure 20-50 year olds can afford it, but if we want the sport to grow we need to start reducing some of the barriers to getting people on the field (i.e. the high cost).
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03-30-2011, 06:16 PM
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#63
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Knight who says Ni
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Port St. Lucie, Fl.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k_autocock_er
......By the time kids are introduced to the sport, they have found passions for others. Kids have youth sports from very young ages. At this age is when kids find that drive and dream to become a star in their sport. Why has nothing been done to try to capitalize on this?.... I can almost guarantee that as children most of played "war" as a child .........Get kids into the sport at a younger age, to keep them and not lose them to another sport......Peronally I don't know why we haven't looked into intigrating our sport into "nerf"....
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How young are we talking?? Youth sports start at 4.
I know that field owners have stated a minimum age of 10 years based on insurance policies. I don't know what it would take to get that rule changed, is it something you would have to pay more for, is it something the insurance companies would have to be willing to change their rules to accommodate?? I also don't know if it really that big of a market to pursue.
I agree that in order for such an idea to be viable a company is going to have to go specifically after it. Something "nurf like" seems like a good idea, but you have a whole pile of new issues to deal with when you start reusing "ammo", anyone else remember gotcha guns?? Spring loaded plastic gun that shot a piece of plastic covered in paint about 10 feet, wore shop goggles and there was little safety concern as it pertained to the equipment. Unless you beat someone about the head with the gun, or poked them in the eye with the barrel before shooting it.
I have a son that will be 6 this October, I would love to be able to set him up this year, b-day or x-mas, with a .50cal system so he can start shooting at things in the back yard, or maybe even get some 1on1 time at the local field just for fun. Although I would love this idea I'm not sure that it's a great idea for the masses, nor do I think it would be highly accepted. He loves paintball, he's seen all the DVD's I own, I have videos of him running around when he could barely walk using anything he could pretend was a gun.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightmare Paintball
....and how a 75% paint price reduction would directly affect the growth of the sport...
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To the consumer, or to the fields & stores??
While I agree 75% would change things, it wouldn't be a great thing across the board.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Paris_82
.....They claim to cheaper paint = more paint shoot = unhappy new players getting over shot... the most ignorant claim in paintball i have ever seen!!....
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The antagonist in me really wanted to post something about you claiming that was ignorant, was the most ignorant claim in paintball I had even seen. But after a couple of hours away from the computer I realized although it is an ignorant statement, it is certainly not the most ignorant claim I have ever seen. In reality it's not even in my top 5 most ignorant claims I have ever seen, I'm fairly certain 4 of the 5 most ignorant statements I have ever heard, I actually said myself. Oh to be young and stupid again, these conversations often remind me of some of the "great ideas" I pitched to various field owners over the years. Which reminds me of being laughed at while the owner walked away after another attempt to explain business to me.
I remember my best idea, I would buy a booster system, the field could use it to make more money off the customers, we charged $1/1K at the time, as long as my team could fill for "free". How could he loose, more money from his current customers and some of the tournament players would return being that we could finally fill to 4500psi. If I remember properly he said no, I don't want the tourney players back, that's why I don't fill over 3k now. I then had the audacity to stand in font of a man who started and ran a successful regional tournament series (PanAm), started a successful paintball publication (APG), helped the development of the AutoCocker and fought to keep paintball legal in the state of California(thus the country), and udder the phrase "you just don't get it". Hahaha, once again an exit while laughing and another attempt at helping me understand business.
At the end of the day you have to fist consider the customer to be provided for, and the best experience you can provide for them. There is no single answer for the whole industry, the $100/case model isn't going to work for every field/player anymore than the $40/case model will work for every field/player. Sure if quality paint could be produced cheaper it would help a number of fields, but the fact is in most all circumstances the fields with lower margins will continue to have lower margins and the fields with higher margins will continue to have higher margins. Plus even if prices dropped some, they realistically won't drop enough to make a huge impact on the whole industry, we might be looking at some savings, but it's not going to be %50+.
__________________
lPlAlIlNlTlBlAlLlLl
My Anti-Savings Account
Ability is what you’re capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. –Lou Holtz (via-John Maxwell)
Advice for the thread: "how to open a paintball store"
NastyShock3r: hey guy's i live in miami i need help to open a paintball store can anyone help or can tell me what i need to do?
midstatepaintball: That's easy! Just push on the front door of the store if it says "push", or pull on the door if it says "pull".
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