I've been overboring paint for a couple years mainly because I practice/recball with some questionable paint like heat sometimes and that **** can have some paintballs that look like triangles thrown in there.
So I thought I would pose this poll and see what some of the people on the nation currently think on this almost as old as the sport debate.
I over bore my paint because I get less barrel breaks and the only time I am near the back of the field is when I walk to the dead box so I don't need the super accuracy or velocity consistency for those 10 yards shots.
I do however have a kit I use sometimes in for tournies, tourny paint I still go over a little but don't just use my .691-3 no matter what so I can get a little better consistant velocity in those any small thing can make or break the game pinches.
.685 small bore if you're a pocket protector wearing, slide rule using underboring paintball supernerd,
.689 regular bore for those who are still wondering if the prostitute they took back to the hotel in Vegas was actually a man
.693 if you're a King Kong sexual tyrannosaurus coming out of the bedroom with a towel wrapped around you drinking kool-aid saying "who's next" overboring super-stud like me
~Mike, I don't personaly respect him or listen to what he has to say but hey it's pretty funny.
I underbore, it's pretty clear that it doesn't break anymore paint than overboring. The only people I see saying it breaks more paint are people that overbore. They usually haven't tried underboring long enough to figure out whether or not it actually does break "more" paint than overboring. "More" being the operative word. If your paint is going to break, it's going to break whether you're shooting a .679 or a .697.
And while I love Mike and all his videos, he's wrong about this. I do love his little list there though lol. In truth though, .685 isn't even small enough. It's overboring in most situations. I've been shooting a .682 for months and haven't gotten a single break. There's really no valid reason to overbore other than maybe you being constantly illogically scared about breaking paint and therefore playing worse because of your irrational fear.
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MIDN 1/C, US Navy FS: Loaded 08 PMR Reason Krew #1 #12 Italian Baller
"Ok sportsfan, how bout this? When was the last time you went out on a boat to defend our country? **** you *******. You're a *****, don't talk down to Warbeak like that."
-Derr
i underbore because i think it saves more air than overboring. also one hot day i was playing wit my bro who was overboring and he had more barrel breaks than i did
Whenever I actualy bust out my kit and use it I normaly match my paint by finding the smallest insert and can still put my mouth on the back and blow the ball through, or atleast make it move a little.
Do you guys get better consistant velocity using an under bore, than this type of 'match' to the paint/barrel? Mines normaly like +/-8 or so using the above method about the most cosistant I ever got was on an old cocker with a freak kit (I don't know what I was thinking with that freak kit noob purchase) that I used to get around +/-4/5 with decen paint.
Whenever I actualy bust out my kit and use it I normaly match my paint by finding the smallest insert and can still put my mouth on the back and blow the ball through, or atleast make it move a little.
Do you guys get better consistant velocity using an under bore, than this type of 'match' to the paint/barrel? Mines normaly like +/-8 or so using the above method about the most cosistant I ever got was on an old cocker with a freak kit (I don't know what I was thinking with that freak kit noob purchase) that I used to get around +/-4/5 with decen paint.
Yea bore matching is definitely inferior to underboring. I noticed a drastic rise in consistency when I switched. I was getting like +10/-10 (averaged) and I cut that in half.
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MIDN 1/C, US Navy FS: Loaded 08 PMR Reason Krew #1 #12 Italian Baller
"Ok sportsfan, how bout this? When was the last time you went out on a boat to defend our country? **** you *******. You're a *****, don't talk down to Warbeak like that."
-Derr
Warpig actually did some tests on the subject of overboring/matching/underboring. Underboring was the most consistent, but least accurate, overboring was in the middle in terms of consistency and accuracy, and although matched paint had the leas consistency, it was the most accurate.
__________________
Lady Vampire Cyborg RX with Gold bolt, and a Sync chip.
Solid Black Vintage '03 Matrix with full Evolve Gold Bolt kit, AKA LPR, Tadao 5.0 board, Dual 7.62 AK47 Volumizers, Tequila breech, Redz leverlock feedneck, Shocktech ASA, and Hyper2.
i overbore thus no reason to worry about balll swelling
I also like the fact the air causes a slight even gap around the ball that keeps it from touching the sides and thus less unwanted spin and drag for a more accurate shot. IMO
Warpig actually did some tests on the subject of overboring/matching/underboring. Underboring was the most consistent, but least accurate, overboring was in the middle in terms of consistency and accuracy, and although matched paint had the leas consistency, it was the most accurate.
Those results are almost the exact opposite of what I've heard from most people.
In todays world of paintball where your putting 10+ balls in the air a second (depending on what format your playin ect. I know I in semi i shoot more than 10 most of the time). A more consistent chrono is my aim, especialy when I am practicing with paint thats not as brittle as I would like.
With good paint I always shoot pretty strait and being up front 99.9% of the time I don't need great ball on ball accuracy for mugging people. I have however had some crazy ****ed up bounces when I run the tape and put 3-4 in someones back and none of them break (local tourny paint selection was a ****ing joke pissed me off and cost me a couple games).
Warpig actually did some tests on the subject of overboring/matching/underboring. Underboring was the most consistent, but least accurate, overboring was in the middle in terms of consistency and accuracy, and although matched paint had the leas consistency, it was the most accurate.
That doesn't make any sense. Bore size has nothing to do with accuracy. In fact I'm going to say that as much as I respect Warpig, they're wrong. All three methods will yield the same accuracy. Here's how it works:
Underboring = Great efficiency, Great consistency
Bore Matching = Average efficiency, Poor consistency
Overboring = Poor efficiency, Great consistency
__________________
MIDN 1/C, US Navy FS: Loaded 08 PMR Reason Krew #1 #12 Italian Baller
"Ok sportsfan, how bout this? When was the last time you went out on a boat to defend our country? **** you *******. You're a *****, don't talk down to Warbeak like that."
-Derr
Those results are almost the exact opposite of what I've heard from most people.
In todays world of paintball where your putting 10+ balls in the air a second (depending on what format your playin ect. I know I in semi i shoot more than 10 most of the time). A more consistent chrono is my aim, especialy when I am practicing with paint thats not as brittle as I would like.
With good paint I always shoot pretty strait and being up front 99.9% of the time I don't need great ball on ball accuracy for mugging people. I have however had some crazy ****ed up bounces when I run the tape and put 3-4 in someones back and none of them break (local tourny paint selection was a ****ing joke pissed me off and cost me a couple games).
Quote:
Originally Posted by warbeak2099
That doesn't make any sense. Bore size has nothing to do with accuracy. In fact I'm going to say that as much as I respect Warpig, they're wrong. All three methods will yield the same accuracy. Here's how it works:
Underboring = Great efficiency, Great consistency
Bore Matching = Average efficiency, Poor consistency
Overboring = Poor efficiency, Great consistency
Not according to the shot grouping tests they did. Look up the test if you care to, but high consistency only equals consistent shot distance and vertical groupings, but because humans tend to be wider than they are tall, and a (comparatively) tiny difference in FPS either way tends to make very little difference unless you are actually shooting to you marker's maximum capable range, consistency makes nowhere near as much difference in accuracy as friction values and the other myriad of variables that send paintballs down range and on target.
Edit: They've done several tests on this subject, and although I couldn't find the original test, here is their review of the Deathstick barrels, included are shot grouping tests where they once again got better accuracy with a larger back. http://www.warpig.com/paintball/tech...els/deathstix/
In their words: "For testing, the Deathstix barrel was mounted on a Matrix LCD equipped with a Crossfire compressed air system and Prophecy loader, bench mounted and fired at paper targets under microprocessor control for 20 shot groupings at a precise rate of 1bps. Distance to target was 75 feet with DXS Gold paintballs using each of the barrel's four breech sizers. Velocity settings on the marker were not changed from group to group, so that an increase or decrease in average velocity could be seen as a sign of gas efficiency differences between the sizers. Consistent with previous testing of other barrel kits, the velocities from the shot groupings with the tighter backs were more consistent than those with the larger bore backs. Despite the relatively short length of the control bore backs they produced a very measurable impact on velocity performance. The tighter sizes also delivered higher average velocities from gas bursts of the same pressure and duration, indicating better gas efficiency with a tighter fit. Also consistent with past testing of other systems, the grouping with the best accuracy was not the grouping with the best velocity consistency. The .692, or third sized back (green in the overlay image) produced the tightest grouping, though the variance in grouping size was not very great between the different backs. Paintball players will typically select a barrel bore size by “blow through” testing – placing a paintball in the back of a barrel, and blowing it out like a blow gun – selecting a barrel or sizer which will hold the paintball and keep it from rolling out, but allow it to blow out easily. This testing, though subjective, indicated the .692 as the insert of choice, and was on the mark for selecting the back which provided the best accuracy."
__________________
Lady Vampire Cyborg RX with Gold bolt, and a Sync chip.
Solid Black Vintage '03 Matrix with full Evolve Gold Bolt kit, AKA LPR, Tadao 5.0 board, Dual 7.62 AK47 Volumizers, Tequila breech, Redz leverlock feedneck, Shocktech ASA, and Hyper2.
Paintball players will typically select a barrel bore size by “blow through” testing – placing a paintball in the back of a barrel, and blowing it out like a blow gun – selecting a barrel or sizer which will hold the paintball and keep it from rolling out, but allow it to blow out easily. This testing, though subjective, indicated the .692 as the insert of choice, and was on the mark for selecting the back which provided the best accuracy."
So in other words the 'blow through' method I've used for years is the best accuracy. For the best chrono consistency under bored is best. Nice to know
Edit: Also after looking at the accuracy pictures in that link it seems like the difference is insignificant. None of them were ball on ball super accurate I can barely tell a difference, gunna try some underboring this weekend just for a break from the norm. Maybe I'll like it.
Yea I know. That fact supports the idea that bore size doesn't affect accuracy. Underboring doesn't hurt accuracy nor does that article suggest that it does. It doesn't list the size of the paint. .686 could very well have been bore matching or overboring in that case depending on how big the paint was. You're making incorrect assumptions based on an article that has nothing to do with what we're talking about.
The facts I posted are the only things that bore size affects. Accuracy is not in the list of those things, period. This has been common knowledge for a while now.
__________________
MIDN 1/C, US Navy FS: Loaded 08 PMR Reason Krew #1 #12 Italian Baller
"Ok sportsfan, how bout this? When was the last time you went out on a boat to defend our country? **** you *******. You're a *****, don't talk down to Warbeak like that."
-Derr
Yea I know. That fact supports the idea that bore size doesn't affect accuracy. Underboring doesn't hurt accuracy nor does that article suggest that it does. It doesn't list the size of the paint. .686 could very well have been bore matching or overboring in that case depending on how big the paint was. You're making incorrect assumptions based on an article that has nothing to do with what we're talking about.
The facts I posted are the only things that bore size affects. Accuracy is not in the list of those things, period. This has been common knowledge for a while now.
"The .692, or third sized back (green in the overlay image) produced the tightest grouping, though the variance in grouping size was not very great between the different backs. Paintball players will typically select a barrel bore size by “blow through” testing – placing a paintball in the back of a barrel, and blowing it out like a blow gun – selecting a barrel or sizer which will hold the paintball and keep it from rolling out, but allow it to blow out easily. This testing, though subjective, indicated the .692 as the insert of choice, and was on the mark for selecting the back which provided the best accuracy."
.692 was the size of the paint, and the bore of the same size produced the best accuracy. Although the difference is small, that was with a barrel that had effective control bores roughly two inches long. It stands to reason the difference would be even more significant if the control bore were longer.
Edit: You're also welcome to provide some reliable contradictory evidence from a credible source, or better yet, the original Warpig test.
__________________
Lady Vampire Cyborg RX with Gold bolt, and a Sync chip.
Solid Black Vintage '03 Matrix with full Evolve Gold Bolt kit, AKA LPR, Tadao 5.0 board, Dual 7.62 AK47 Volumizers, Tequila breech, Redz leverlock feedneck, Shocktech ASA, and Hyper2.
"The .692, or third sized back (green in the overlay image) produced the tightest grouping, though the variance in grouping size was not very great between the different backs. Paintball players will typically select a barrel bore size by “blow through” testing – placing a paintball in the back of a barrel, and blowing it out like a blow gun – selecting a barrel or sizer which will hold the paintball and keep it from rolling out, but allow it to blow out easily. This testing, though subjective, indicated the .692 as the insert of choice, and was on the mark for selecting the back which provided the best accuracy."
.692 was the size of the paint, and the bore of the same size produced the best accuracy. Although the difference is small, that was with a barrel that had effective control bores roughly two inches long. It stands to reason the difference would be even more significant if the control bore were longer.
Edit: You're also welcome to provide some reliable contradictory evidence from a credible source, or better yet, the original Warpig test.
I can't because the data is all on "that other site". But you're welcome to google Punkworks and see for yourself why that Warpig test is incorrect.
EDIT: Actually, going back and looking at that article almost made me spit up my coffee laughing. There is little to no significant difference between the groupings. I didn't pay enough attention to that picture at first. When you do examine it closely, you realize the accuracy was the same for all the sizes. Again, the conclusions of the test were wrong, bore size doesn't affect accuracy. Warpig is great a lot of the time, but I do frequently see them perpetuating long held stereotypes and myths that are just downright false. This is an example of them twisting data to do just that.
__________________
MIDN 1/C, US Navy FS: Loaded 08 PMR Reason Krew #1 #12 Italian Baller
"Ok sportsfan, how bout this? When was the last time you went out on a boat to defend our country? **** you *******. You're a *****, don't talk down to Warbeak like that."
-Derr
Last edited by warbeak2099 : 09-24-2009 at 10:24 AM.
noob purchase) that I used to get around +/-4/5 with decen paint.
