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Old 01-21-2013, 01:50 PM #295
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really only 2 things there are unsupported but i see your point. However it does not make sense to me to let Valken monopolize the the Nppl. All Nppl vs PSP arguing aside Empire and GI are not supporting the NPPL. They are basically telling their customer base that plays NPPL that they are not going to support them. This will make many Empire and Gi customers go to Valken. In short Valken is making money at the NPPL events since they get 100% of the sales. On top of that this causes many fields to switch to Valken paint to get better Event deals for their teams. If the other big boys want Valken to die why are they willingly giving them a market?
It doesn't make sense for GI/Kee, as part owners of PSP, to sell their product at or support the NPPL. It can be argued that it wouldn't make sense for them even if they were not part owners of the PSP, assuming they have a valid reason to not participate (lost money or very marginal profits per event).

GI/Kee are making the long-term play and are watching their consumers closely. As many here have said, the PSP seems to be prospering where the NPPL seems to be coming up short.

I doubt VERY highly that many field owners will switch to Valken to appease their local teams (where most don't make their money) unless it makes business sense AND all of their teams only want to play NPPL. It goes both ways.
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:58 PM #296
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GI/Kee are making the long-term play and are watching their consumers closely. As many here have said, the PSP seems to be prospering where the NPPL seems to be coming up short.
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Old 01-21-2013, 03:13 PM #297
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Alright i really did not want to say anything but this whole thing goes back about a year ago.

1. EArly 2012- valken, GI, And empire are planned to support the NPPL. A couple of weeks before HB Empire and GI( might have talked to valken about it too) decided that they were no longer supporting the league. thier goal was to have the league die.

2. Hb 2012-Valken and some other small paint company are the only paint venders at HB

3. PSP 2012- Valken is told they are not allowed to sell paint at PSP events because " it would cause Empire and GI to not make money". *next part is not fact just what im pretty sure happened ** Empire and GI most likely bullied the PSP to not allow Valken in.

4. December 2012- PSP announces that all paint vendors will be allowed to sell paint at 2013 events. Valken plans to support PSP in 2013 at the same price as the other two venders

5. * this part is also not fact just speculation* Empire and GI complain to the PSP about valken being in the psp.

6. Empire and GI plan once again not to support the Nppl. This leaves Valken as the only paint vendor for the year . NPPL names Valken the exclusive paint of the NPPL 2013 season.

7. PSP extends an offer to Valken to come on board as a paint sponsor for a league that is supported in part by some level of ownership by Kee/GI (with whom they likely have a deal in place already, as well). The offer includes a buy-in fee to comp the expected hit the other two paint sponsors would see in their paint sales.

8. Gino posts that he is being extorted on Facebook and all hell breaks loose.

P.S yes my spelling sucks
Whose to say next year when the NPPL is dead and gone that KEE & GI don't pressure the PSP to make Valkens buy in $50k per event, knowing Valken has no other choice but to pay it other than supporting scenario events
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Old 01-21-2013, 04:30 PM #298
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Whose to say next year when the NPPL is dead and gone that KEE & GI don't pressure the PSP to make Valkens buy in $50k per event, knowing Valken has no other choice but to pay it other than supporting scenario events
No one is saying that. That's a very real possibility and a legitimate business proposal considering they just got an offer to join the PSP at $10k and not only declined but seemingly tried to throw PSP under the bus with words like "extortion."

Just saying, if I were PSP/KEE/GI and the NPPL folded, I would not be kind to Valken after this whole mess.
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:32 PM #299
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Originally Posted by sstiggy View Post
Whose to say next year when the NPPL is dead and gone that KEE & GI don't pressure the PSP to make Valkens buy in $50k per event, knowing Valken has no other choice but to pay it other than supporting scenario events
In case you haven't noticed, the PSP has been getting along great without Valken dealing paint, as it has since its formation. The notion that Valken has to be present is silly. Furthermore, the PSP has every right to charge whatever fee it wants for each vendor and deal with whatever consequences there may be. Valken was offered the opportunity to sell their paint at PSP events and declined. Not only did they decline, but Gino decided to stir the pot with a Facebook account posting an outrageous misrepresentation of what actually transpired. If you're worried about getting a paint deal as a PSP team that only has Valken dealers nearby, apply to the Empire/GI sponsorship programs directly and they'll point you in the right direction. Any team displaced by this announcement will be back on track by next season. Above all, don't gamble your season on the presence of a company with no significant history in your league of choice.
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:54 PM #300
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In case you haven't noticed, the PSP has been getting along great without Valken dealing paint, as it has since its formation. The notion that Valken has to be present is silly. Furthermore, the PSP has every right to charge whatever fee it wants for each vendor and deal with whatever consequences there may be. Valken was offered the opportunity to sell their paint at PSP events and declined. Not only did they decline, but Gino decided to stir the pot with a Facebook account posting an outrageous misrepresentation of what actually transpired. If you're worried about getting a paint deal as a PSP team that only has Valken dealers nearby, apply to the Empire/GI sponsorship programs directly and they'll point you in the right direction. Any team displaced by this announcement will be back on track by next season. Above all, don't gamble your season on the presence of a company with no significant history in your league of choice.
No one said Valken needs to be present, what I said was that if Valken jumps to PSP, thus cutting ties with NPPL (which depends on Valken to survive), and the NPPL goes away, then they are at PSPs mercy to be in the league after this year and would have to pay any amount the PSP seemed fit

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Old 01-21-2013, 06:05 PM #301
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You would think if PSP wanted to kill NPPL by pulling Valken out, they would offer Valken a discount.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:15 PM #302
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Also, since Valken is the only paint vendor at NPPL, Even with half the turn out they are selling just as much paint as GI / KEE at the PSP events since there will be a split between the paint sold there.

It doesn't make sence for Valken to pull out of the NPPL due to.

1) Being the only manufacture there, they get %100 of sales
2) Having to pay 10k more
3) Their sales would drop %75 or more, People are going to shoot Kee/GI paint first, unless they have a deal with Valken.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:20 PM #303
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Also, since Valken is the only paint vendor at NPPL, Even with half the turn out they are selling just as much paint as GI / KEE at the PSP events since there will be a split between the paint sold there.

It doesn't make sence for Valken to pull out of the NPPL due to.

1) Being the only manufacture there, they get %100 of sales
2) Having to pay 10k more
3) Their sales would drop %75 or more, People are going to shoot Kee/GI paint first, unless they have a deal with Valken.
that was all said already.
but when/if the NPPL goes belly up, which lets face it, is a realistic possibility in the next year or two... Valken will then have nowhere to sell their paint at a national level.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:23 PM #304
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that was all said already.
but when/if the NPPL goes belly up, which lets face it, is a realistic possibility in the next year or two... Valken will then have nowhere to sell their paint at a national level.
Exactly the point I was making, they can be leveraged out
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:27 PM #305
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No one said Valken needs to be present, what I said was that if Valken jumps to PSP, thus cutting ties with NPPL (which depends on Valken to survive), and the NPPL goes away, then they are at PSPs mercy to be in the league after this year and would have to pay any amount the PSP seemed fit
Read my post again. Your point is predicated on the assumption that Valken cannot decline the terms set by the PSP and focus resources elsewhere. Who said Valken has to be at the PSP in the first place? Furthermore, who said that the phone call this whole thread is about did not include the possibility of equal pricing for all paint vendors in future seasons after this has blown over?
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:53 PM #306
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worst thread ever
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:19 PM #307
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:28 PM #308
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:31 PM #309
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Even Slowiak stepped in. Lol. I hope Valken dies with NPPL honestly.
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:38 PM #310
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worst thread ever
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:43 PM #311
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:48 PM #312
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sounds fair enough to keep valken out of psp if other paint vendors cant vend at the nppl!

no one is complaining that valken is the only vendor allowed to sell paint in the nppl!
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:54 PM #313
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Old 01-21-2013, 08:12 PM #314
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Also, since Valken is the only paint vendor at NPPL, Even with half the turn out they are selling just as much paint as GI / KEE at the PSP events since there will be a split between the paint sold there.
But the total amount of market share is in the PSP vendors' favour, due to the double turnout, if not more (speculation, but likely).
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Old 01-21-2013, 08:47 PM #315
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But the total amount of market share is in the PSP vendors' favour, due to the double turnout, if not more (speculation, but likely).
Wrong.

The total amount of market share is still even, because even though there's double the participation in the PSP, you also have two equally used vendors.
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