[Iamamartianchurch]

Originally Posted by licence2kill

The problem is dead people can't pay.

Good point. I got nothing right now.

[Iamamartianchurch]

[quote=marcozombie;77817357]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

You cause damage, you pay. QUOTE]

Yep, pretty much how it goes. Sounds like personal responsibility to me:

You cause damage and it is determined it was your fault,you get to pay.
Use your car in an irrisponsible manner, your premiums go up. Since the comparison to guns is always made then fine...I have no problem making gun owners insure their fire arms. Raise the accountablity and have as many as you want/afford.

We also have to have a license to operate a vehicle AND have that vehicle registered...I like that for firearms as well.

I know your position. I was just saying that I have some hesitations towards requirements for insurance.

[Bloodeagle]

[quote=marcozombie;77817357]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

You cause damage, you pay. QUOTE]

Yep, pretty much how it goes. Sounds like personal responsibility to me:

You cause damage and it is determined it was your fault,you get to pay.
Use your car in an irrisponsible manner, your premiums go up. Since the comparison to guns is always made then fine...I have no problem making gun owners insure their fire arms. Raise the accountablity and have as many as you want/afford.

We also have to have a license to operate a vehicle AND have that vehicle registered...I like that for firearms as well.

I actually don't have a huge problem with this. Extend it to other items that people use to harm others to make it fair, of course. To make it simple, extend homeowners/renters insurance to cover this. However, this won't be the end of it for you lefties, will it?

[tomM925]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

You cause damage, you pay. QUOTE]

Yep, pretty much how it goes. Sounds like personal responsibility to me:

You cause damage and it is determined it was your fault,you get to pay.
Use your car in an irrisponsible manner, your premiums go up. Since the comparison to guns is always made then fine...I have no problem making gun owners insure their fire arms. Raise the accountablity and have as many as you want/afford.

You shoot someone, you go to Prison. Accountability.

[marcozombie]

[quote=Bloodeagle;77817430]

Originally Posted by marcozombie

I actually don't have a huge problem with this. Extend it to other items that people use to harm others to make it fair, of course. To make it simple, extend homeowners/renters insurance to cover this. However, this won't be the end of it for you lefties, will it?

It would be for this one that has no interest in taking peoples guns away.

[marcozombie]

Originally Posted by tomM925

You shoot someone, you go to Prison. Accountability.

You shoot someone with someone elses gun, the owner also should be held accountable.

[Swerve22]

Originally Posted by marcozombie

You shoot someone with someone elses gun, the owner also should be held accountable.

Yeah, because the owner obviously gave you permission to shoot someone when you stole their gun.

[tomM925]

This is retarded.

[marcozombie]

Owner should have made sure only he/she has access to his stash and no one else...just like with motor vehicles.

[marcozombie]

If my kid gets ahold of my weapon and causes damage to property or physical harm, then I (the owner) should be held liable. Just like I am liable with my motor vehicle. Not a hard concept to grasp.

[Iamamartianchurch]

Originally Posted by marcozombie

You shoot someone with someone elses gun, the owner also should be held accountable.

That's pretty extreme, even for me.

[marcozombie]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

That's pretty extreme, even for me.

Extreme? Really? This is how it already works in some states with regard to motor vehicles... Why not fire arms?

[TheSilentAssassin]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

That's pretty extreme, even for me.

I think we need to break down this generalization. If I leave the trigger to a bomb lying around in my front yard and someone's kids sees it and blows it up killing hundreds of people, then I am surely at fault. If someone breaks into my house, disarms a complex security code and series of complicated locks to steal my car and then kills someone with it, then I am far less responsible. Obviously, these are absurd, but prove a point. A locked and secured gun that is stolen from ones house is not on the same level as a loaded shotgun sitting in your open garage.

[Drex17]

Originally Posted by marcozombie

If my kid gets ahold of my weapon and causes damage to property or physical harm, then I (the owner) should be held liable. Just like I am liable with my motor vehicle. Not a hard concept to grasp.

That's already how it is in some places, if I leave my handgun sitting on my nightstand and let's say one of my young cousins gets a hold of it and kills himself or someone else. I go to prison. That said here, and any laws of this nature should require negligence, not a blanket punishment.

[marcozombie]

Originally Posted by Drex17

That's already how it is in some places, if I leave my handgun sitting on my nightstand and let's say one of my young cousins gets a hold of it and kills himself or someone else. I go to prison. That said here, and any laws of this nature should require negligence, not a blanket punishment.

... Safe drivers pay less in insurance premiums than do drivers with a history of safety infractions. Safe drivers Get an insurance discount for going to defensive driving every so often... I'm Suggesting the same type insurance guide lines/incentives for owners of fire arms.

[tomM925]

Originally Posted by marcozombie

... Safe drivers pay less in insurance premiums than do drivers with a history of safety infractions. Safe drivers Get an insurance discount for going to defensive driving every so often... I'm Suggesting the same type insurance guide lines/incentives for owners of fire arms.

Safe gun owners get to keep firearms. Those convicted with gun charges go to prison and or lose the right to own firearms. Incentive.

[Iamamartianchurch]

Originally Posted by TheSilentAssassin

I think we need to break down this generalization. If I leave the trigger to a bomb lying around in my front yard and someone's kids sees it and blows it up killing hundreds of people, then I am surely at fault. If someone breaks into my house, disarms a complex security code and series of complicated locks to steal my car and then kills someone with it, then I am far less responsible. Obviously, these are absurd, but prove a point. A locked and secured gun that is stolen from ones house is not on the same level as a loaded shotgun sitting in your open garage.

I'm on board for accountability if a minor is involved. If another adult steals my car or my gun under any circumstances and kills someone with, I am not responsible. They are adults they have agency. I'm not going to concede on this one.

[Iamamartianchurch]

Originally Posted by marcozombie

Extreme? Really? This is how it already works in some states with regard to motor vehicles... Why not fire arms?

I can understand holding an adult accountable if a minor takes his gun and commits a crime, but not for another adult. It is not my problem that the offender is a thief AND a murderer.

[TheSilentAssassin]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

I'm on board for accountability if a minor is involved. If another adult steals my car or my gun under any circumstances and kills someone with, I am not responsible. They are adults they have agency. I'm not going to concede on this one.

I would obvious extend that to the mentally disabled as well (and I am sure you would, too), but other than that I think I agree.

[Iamamartianchurch]

Originally Posted by TheSilentAssassin

I would obvious extend that to the mentally disabled as well (and I am sure you would, too), but other than that I think I agree.

Actually mentally disabled, not some regular guy who's had a hard life or has experienced some tragedy that magically robbed him of all agency. With that said, I'll agree.

[marcozombie]

Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch

I can understand holding an adult accountable if a minor takes his gun and commits a crime, but not for another adult. It is not my problem that the offender is a thief AND a murderer.

Of course, I didn't mean to leave the impression that i thought otherwise. Matter of fact, I beleive it is the same situation with motor vehicles: you cant be held accountable if someone steals your car out of your carport and wrecks into another vehicle (state to state of course).