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Old 09-30-2012, 12:56 PM #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vijil View Post
Bolter, you breakout less for the amount of time played. That's what we were saying - thought it was obvious in context. I don't think it's that big a deal though. Having less runthroughs and more emphasis on holding down lanes is a bigger deal from a spectator perspective.

You don't have to play a format to have a pretty good idea of how it will go down based on a wide ranging experience with formats and playstyles. You can tell to a certain extent immediately what sort of tactics a gamestyle will encourage - not 100% but fairly well so long as you have all the facts.

But don't get me wrong, I still think F5 is better than any form of regular CTF for tournaments. I disagree with Nick in that regard because I think the current formats are completely broken from the ground up. They say if it aint broke don't fix it. I say it's broke. F5 deals with or negates a number of the inherent problems of the usual formats. I also said that based on my experience and not having actually played it, but nobody minded then.
Interesting debate this

Can you please elaborate on what is broken?
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Old 09-30-2012, 12:57 PM #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bolter View Post
Lack of breakouts? We still break out and try to get to the 50's/buzzer on the break. No one here has played it yet you all know exactly how it goes down.

Brilliant well done everyone!
There are quite a few Formula5 videos available on Youtube Bolter
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:12 PM #108
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Nick answer one question have you played this format,
if not then you can`t comment,looking at youtube tells you nothing.
play it then comment,then you have grounds too say good or bad
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:16 PM #109
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Well, we'll see how it goes at Paris!

Very curious how this format will be to watch, think it will be a lot of fun!
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:21 PM #110
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Hope they do this with a better layout and no milsim bunkers
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Old 09-30-2012, 03:20 PM #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b15cu1t View Post
Nick answer one question have you played this format,
if not then you can`t comment,looking at youtube tells you nothing.
play it then comment,then you have grounds too say good or bad
That's a BS argument.

Ofcourse I - or anyone else - can comment based on an understanding of the format and seeing videos online, without having played it..... especially if you have extensive experience in the sport.

I am fairly certain you get to have an opinion and even vote in elections, without having been a soldier, or socialworker, or doctor, or educator, or policeman - or whatever.

It's not everyone (only some) that has to experience something first hand, to form an informed opinion

But, feel free to tell me where I am misunderstanding the format
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:41 PM #112
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format

I don't mind the idea of re-insertions. They just have to be managed properly so that the players(on both teams) can keep track of them and so that one team can't perform the equivalent of a Battlefield 3 base rape on the other team lol. Maybe allow insertions anywhere on the teams back line and use a really large field so insertions happen well away from the focal point of the game. I guess the "end zone" idea helps with that although one team can still lock down a zone under the right circumstances. Perhaps making the ends of the field rounded, rather than the usual rectangle. That way inserting players have an angle advantage on campers outside the zone?

I'd actually hate to see the urban bunkers alone used in this format since they typically only play from one direction even though they can be angled. I'd use more 3D shaped bunkers....maybe bring back some of those cool older NPPL 10 man bunkers like the Giant spider, or the massive rockets.....that type of thing lol. Those were the best years of paintball ever since they created soooooooo many options for players. Not just sitting there shooting each other in the face. That's what spectators(who may not play paintball) want to see. All kinds of crazy stuff going on! Not that some race too format games can't be exciting but let's face it.....a majority of them are pretty much carbon copies of each other.
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:58 PM #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Brockdorff View Post
That's a BS argument.

Ofcourse I - or anyone else - can comment based on an understanding of the format and seeing videos online, without having played it..... especially if you have extensive experience in the sport.

I am fairly certain you get to have an opinion and even vote in elections, without having been a soldier, or socialworker, or doctor, or educator, or policeman - or whatever.

It's not everyone (only some) that has to experience something first hand, to form an informed opinion

But, feel free to tell me where I am misunderstanding the format
quite true nick but when the videos are old and the format has had alot of tweaks since they where filmed ,then you can`t make an informed opinion,so my arguement is not BS
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Old 10-01-2012, 04:45 PM #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MstrKey View Post
That's what spectators(who may not play paintball) want to see. All kinds of crazy stuff going on! Not that some race too format games can't be exciting but let's face it.....a majority of them are pretty much carbon copies of each other.
I fully agree

But, I think that has very little to do with the race-to formats. If anything, they should promote greater risktaking, than single match CTF.

I think it has everything to do with props and layouts.

The smaller the props get, the more we promote maintaining lanes and playing - if not defensively - then at least counter-punch paintball.

Couple that with layouts that generally only promote attacking on the wires, and you end up with a game that seems stale and repetitive, to the untrained eye.

The bunkers kits either need more bunkers, or we need more big bunkers, in order to be able to build fields that promote creative and fast play.... I'd say the kits need to be either 50-52 bunkers, or trees need to be swapped out for real playable bunkers, like cans, mayas and temples, while keeping it at 44 (just for instance, to give you an idea of the scale of change I propose)

However, the Formula5 videos I have seen, have so many bunkers that it would be horrendously expensive for most field owners and leagues to run the format on a grand scale, and secondly, I still very much object to the "running re-insertion" that is central to the format, for reasons earlier stated.
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Old 10-01-2012, 04:47 PM #115
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Originally Posted by b15cu1t View Post
quite true nick but when the videos are old and the format has had alot of tweaks since they where filmed ,then you can`t make an informed opinion,so my arguement is not BS
So, please tell me if the things I object to in the format, has been changed?

- Field size
- Number of bunkers
- Reinsertion during the game
- No game breaks (with following breakout)

???

If they are all still in there, I maintain my criticism of the format, irrespective of not having seen it outside of Youtube
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Old 10-01-2012, 04:57 PM #116
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- Field size- changed to suit sites
- Number of bunkers -yes
- Reinsertion during the game- no still there
- No game breaks (with following breakout) -no

???
nick just for you the rule book
http://www.formula5paintball.com/upl...une%202012.pdf

Last edited by b15cu1t : 10-01-2012 at 05:07 PM.
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:56 PM #117
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Nick you saying you are qualified to make an opinion on something you have never played and only saw videos because you have played 20 years you have no idea of the tactics involved that cannot be seen and believe me the tactical side of this game has not even been touched yet , And you also claim that the Brits on the forum are only saying what they are say because of national loyalties .

You are so full of it I wont even bother arguing any more with someone who contradicts him self so much and who clearly is so full of bull.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:34 AM #118
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Originally Posted by Icehole View Post
Nick you saying you are qualified to make an opinion on something you have never played and only saw videos because you have played 20 years you have no idea of the tactics involved that cannot be seen and believe me the tactical side of this game has not even been touched yet , And you also claim that the Brits on the forum are only saying what they are say because of national loyalties .

You are so full of it I wont even bother arguing any more with someone who contradicts him self so much and who clearly is so full of bull.
Where am I contradicting myself exactly?

I have not said brits "only" say what they do, due to national loyalties - all I said was it played a part, which arguably may be larger for some than others.

I honestly don't think the format is that complicated to understand..... and if you believe one would have to play it to understand it, I think that just illustrates how people are different and have different ways to accumulate knowledge and gain understanding

It DOES make wonder however, how you think the format came about in the first place, if your premise is one has to play the format to understand it?

That goes for any format for that matter
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:39 AM #119
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This looks like a lot of fun for a recbal or fun games, not for an international series. I would love to play this layout, maybe different rules but I would try it.
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Old 10-02-2012, 08:42 AM #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b15cu1t View Post
- Field size- changed to suit sites
- Number of bunkers -yes
- Reinsertion during the game- no still there
- No game breaks (with following breakout) -no
1+2:
Naturally.

So, if the format is played with a standard MS field kit, how does it play out compared to the M7 format?

- I would think the format, with the central position you have to hold, would require quite a few more bunkers than the usual MS kit, to be effective?

Question (to me) then becomes, if it is the added number of bunkers that make people like the format, or the format itself..... because my thinking is, that the normal MS format would play great, with more/bigger bunkers.... and that our problems with the current game being stale, is not about format, but about field design and props.

3:
Thought so

4:
Thought so
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:30 PM #121
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Let's face it people are going to enjoy it no matter what. It's paintball. Being an old school baller, anything that promotes chaos out there is good in my book. Anything that is cut and dry, is bad. When I say good and bad I mean for both players and spectators equally, though in a crunch I would favour the players obviously.

Reinsertions while not ethically a problem for me.....I only object to in a playable sense. You'd think they would promote chaos but.....in most cases I've seen, they promote a lockdown. If they find a way to prevent this....perhaps with limited paint or structural changes then I'd be happy to eat my words. Ultimately I just see it as an expensive game that could have just ended a lot sooner(and cheaper) without the reinsertions.

For those who have played the format.........how do the games usually play out? Give and take? Lockdown? Both teams running out of paint?
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Old 10-04-2012, 04:39 PM #122
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i'll be there for this so this should be interesting to see the opening of this and also pictures and video
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Old 10-05-2012, 02:57 PM #123
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Originally Posted by MstrKey View Post
Let's face it people are going to enjoy it no matter what. It's paintball. Being an old school baller, anything that promotes chaos out there is good in my book. Anything that is cut and dry, is bad. When I say good and bad I mean for both players and spectators equally, though in a crunch I would favour the players obviously.

Reinsertions while not ethically a problem for me.....I only object to in a playable sense. You'd think they would promote chaos but.....in most cases I've seen, they promote a lockdown. If they find a way to prevent this....perhaps with limited paint or structural changes then I'd be happy to eat my words. Ultimately I just see it as an expensive game that could have just ended a lot sooner(and cheaper) without the reinsertions.

For those who have played the format.........how do the games usually play out? Give and take? Lockdown? Both teams running out of paint?
If you get 2 good teams playing each other the game can sometimes go back and forth one minute you think team A is going to dominate the game only for team B to turn the game around.

Its very similar to xball but the game is played in stages at the start you lane and try to get people out from the break so you can send someone to hit the buzzer safely , after that you can lock the buzzer down or try to gain more of the field but if you go too far then you can run out of paint and have a long way to run back.

the team that does not have the buzzer now have to make some moves to get it back so you see muggings and run through.
I hope the smaller millennium field plays like the field in Colchester its hard but fun.
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Old 10-05-2012, 03:09 PM #124
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cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by Icehole View Post
If you get 2 good teams playing each other the game can sometimes go back and forth one minute you think team A is going to dominate the game only for team B to turn the game around.

Its very similar to xball but the game is played in stages at the start you lane and try to get people out from the break so you can send someone to hit the buzzer safely , after that you can lock the buzzer down or try to gain more of the field but if you go too far then you can run out of paint and have a long way to run back.

the team that does not have the buzzer now have to make some moves to get it back so you see muggings and run through.
I hope the smaller millennium field plays like the field in Colchester its hard but fun.

Sounds good. I think a smaller field will dampen the game though, unless they compensate with more bunkers. Personally I love fields where you can't even get up to full running speed anywhere. Lots of suprises that way.
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Old 10-05-2012, 08:26 PM #125
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if this format gets more people playing and less "spectating" that's good.
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Old 10-18-2012, 12:04 PM #126
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did anyone go ? how did the smaller play ? common someone must know
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