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Old 09-10-2012, 12:24 PM #1
TeacherCreature
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
New Field Owner Questions

We are opening a new field. Purchased almost 20 acres mostly woods with 2 or 3 fields. 1 for parking 1 for staging /speed ball 3rd for speedball?
We still need netting, and CO2 station tanks etc.
We already have rentals, and Compresed air system.
Going to incorporate and insure this week.

so a few questions,
1. there is an awesome 100 acre place about an hour away, should we introduce ourselves to him or hold off.
2. There is a local retail store 5 miles away, no fields but he does have a dozen guys Sat and Sun year round that get together rent from him buy paint and caravan to random friends houses that have open fields or woods. I dont beleive he is insured, I know he doesnt even chrono any of the guns when I asked about fps he said you shoot whatever gun you bring and they are all different!!!!! Should I introduce my self to him?
3. Where is a good place to get larger supply CO2 tanks, shoudl I rent or buy?
4. If I can only start with one speedball field (hay/tire bunkers) and one woodsfield (not much to it) how much should I charge.
5. I want to grow this into something awesome and be around for years but I dont want to charge a lot if I dont offer alot, but I dont want to undercharge. Any advice here is welcomed.
6. I dont have a huge budget yet for things like air bunkers or expensive carpentry made bunkers (although I will put alot of the business money back into it) any ideas?

Basically I dont want to be known as that sh**ty small field with nothing to it and lose repeat players. I will lower price if it is a good idea but I do want to grow it and hopefully one day make a nice profit

Right now we have 15 tippman 98s 5 a5s 10 compressed air tanks and 20 masks. we have 2 air fill stations and 4 scuba tanks, and a compressor.

Thanks guys in advance for any help. Woudl love any ideas for field development, needed equip I might be missing, expenses to save for etc etc etc.
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Old 09-10-2012, 12:28 PM #2
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PS the bigger place is $25 to get in $10 rental $60 a case of lower grade paint

the retail crappy store is $35 rental $0 with your own gear and $42 for walmart grade paint
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:50 PM #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeacherCreature View Post
We are opening a new field. Purchased almost 20 acres mostly woods with 2 or 3 fields. 1 for parking 1 for staging /speed ball 3rd for speedball?
We still need netting, and CO2 station tanks etc.
We already have rentals, and Compresed air system.
Going to incorporate and insure this week.

so a few questions,
1. there is an awesome 100 acre place about an hour away, should we introduce ourselves to him or hold off.

you will want to introduce yourself and your best to have a good working relationship with him. you may be able to save cost by borrowing rentals from him if you have a busy weekend or vice versa as well as buy paint on short notice.
2. There is a local retail store 5 miles away, no fields but he does have a dozen guys Sat and Sun year round that get together rent from him buy paint and caravan to random friends houses that have open fields or woods. I dont beleive he is insured, I know he doesnt even chrono any of the guns when I asked about fps he said you shoot whatever gun you bring and they are all different!!!!! Should I introduce my self to him?you may refer people to go get guns repaired there and misc parts that you do not have on hand. he might be willing to put of fliers for you in exchange for referals that help him profit
3. Where is a good place to get larger supply CO2 tanks, shoudl I rent or buy?rent until you can afford a good compressed air setup and get everything switched over to that with Co2 as a fail safe
4. If I can only start with one speedball field (hay/tire bunkers) and one woodsfield (not much to it) how much should I charge.charge what you need to support your business and make a profit, in conjunction with what you feel you can provide experience wise
5. I want to grow this into something awesome and be around for years but I dont want to charge a lot if I dont offer alot, but I dont want to undercharge. Any advice here is welcomed.you can make nice fields out of anything from junk cars, to urban fields with scraps for building projects.and things that last a long time with little maintenance are what your looking for. as a new field i would stay away from airball fields/players until you are more familiar with the sport and cost and maintenance associated with airball fields
6. I dont have a huge budget yet for things like air bunkers or expensive carpentry made bunkers (although I will put alot of the business money back into it) any ideas?focus on staff training and a clean respectable and safe facility where people can enjoy themselves

Basically I dont want to be known as that sh**ty small field with nothing to it and lose repeat players. I will lower price if it is a good idea but I do want to grow it and hopefully one day make a nice profityou can always lower the pricing later, but if you want to increase it your going to have to sell your customers even harder on the idea of paying more so keep that in mind before you make pricing changes

Right now we have 15 tippman 98s 5 a5s 10 compressed air tanks and 20 masks. we have 2 air fill stations and 4 scuba tanks, and a compressor.
build your inventory slow, no need to get out of hand, but have someone you can call if you get in a bind.
Thanks guys in advance for any help. Woudl love any ideas for field development, needed equip I might be missing, expenses to save for etc etc etc.
be ready for everything unexpected to happen at anytime. netting may blow down poles can break, compressor can go down.

you want to be prepared for anything at anytime.

good luck!
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:55 PM #4
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A few tips from the top of my head:

You need to offer something different from everyone else. Find YOUR hook.
I suggest concentrating your efforts one one great field rather than two ok ones.
I would avoid hay and tires.
Hay attracts snakes and rats, then it rots and becomes a seriously gross smelly slime mound.
Tires attract many nasty critters and fill with a rainwater/paintball slurry that smells like death. after you realise you don't want them, it will cost you a fortune to get rid of them.
It is ok to start small and grow as long as everything you do, you do with exceptional service.
If you can't fill a huge field with great bunkers then fill a small field with great bunkers. You won't have tons of players to begin with anyway and when the crowd picks up because you are offering them a fun time, all of a sudden you will have the income to build more fields.
Do not under value yourself. If you are not going to make a decent profit then stop now and save yourself the agony of a slow expensive death.
Don't worry so much about what the competition charges. The trick is figuring out how much you can charge. Offer a good value for an awesome time. If your customers leave saying "that was fun!" then how much it cost makes no difference so make sure they are smiling and make sure you get their last dollar.
This forum is a great resource but be very wary of the advice you will get from here. The largest percentage of posters are people who will never be your customers and if you cater your business to their wants... you are doomed.
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Old 09-10-2012, 02:20 PM #5
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1. Who is your customer? How far will they drive for what features, benefits, and or attractions? What will they pay if they make the drive? What are the real costs associated with taking on a 100 acre venue? Introduce yourself: to explore the opportunity - yes. To negotiate at such an early stage - no.

2. Who is his customer? Cheap, segregated, poor sports, illegal field mentality. Hmmm, I think not unless you plan on modeling your operation after their current level of conduct.

3. intentionally skipped.

4. Know your customer: what do they pay for ilk products and services in your market? Look for a field with a similar market position and customer demographic as yours and then set your pricing. Do not ask your locals what they will pay! Determine your expenses and profit margin and then set your prices to achieve success.


5. If you plan to grow then price your operation where you want to be and not where you are. If you price it where you are then you will stay where you are and not be able to afford to grow.


6. Start with what you have, natural terrain, woods, streams, etc... utilize your assets and imagination will get you a long way when a budget is restrictive.

Last edited by RenoIndoorPaintball : 09-10-2012 at 02:23 PM.
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:40 PM #6
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We don't do co2 at all... Just get some extra tanks, and rent all tanks for all day use instead of filling co2. It is cheaper and better off in the long run, and safer.

And I'd introduce my self to everyone. If you do a decent job of marketing, they'll know about you soon enough. May as well have a chance to be the good guy instead of the sneaky guy.
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Old 09-10-2012, 08:52 PM #7
TeacherCreature
 
 
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wow some great advice.
I was gonna offer co2 but rent comp air. How many reasonable fills can a 80 foot 3000 psi tank fill we are using 47cu 3000 psi tanks as rentals. (cant afford cascade yet) and I only have 4 80 foot tanks is that enough for 20 rentals for the day ?

also great advice on tires and hay, I only though of them because they are FREE any other free or close to free ideas for a small 3on3 or 5on5 speed ball field.

Also good point on not being sneakyand introducing self although that illegal guy is near by and i think we are gonna kill his business so not sure how we will be received? oh well i guess.

actually some really good advice on pricing and everything else too thanks again and keep it coming This is one of the only really helpful forums out there
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Old 09-10-2012, 10:18 PM #8
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wow some great advice.
I was gonna offer co2 but rent comp air. How many reasonable fills can a 80 foot 3000 psi tank fill we are using 47cu 3000 psi tanks as rentals. (cant afford cascade yet) and I only have 4 80 foot tanks is that enough for 20 rentals for the day ?
http://www.scubatoys.com/paintball/scubafills2.asp
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Old 09-11-2012, 09:49 AM #9
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I saw that once before but im noto sure at what point the pressure becomes low and silly.
If I filla47cubicand it only goes to 1500psi will the player get 500 shots out of that tank or is it a waste of time?

also is there a cheap way to cascade tanks? I have 4 of these tanks and probably get 1 or 2 more
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:06 AM #10
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If you already have the tanks and the compressor, you are only some valves and hoses away from a cascade system.

Is your compressor rated for continuous duty? If yes then you should be in good shape to get started.

Before putting any more money into a SCUBA based system, consider selling the SCUBA stuff you have and getting bulk HPA tanks instead. You can get by with SCUBA tanks at first but will want to change over eventually anyway so I wouldn't put more money into it.

I totally agree with Larry, nix the Co2 completely and just get some extra HPA tanks for rentals.
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:17 AM #11
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As far as using free stuff for the bunkers... unless someone is giving away quality building materials, don't bother. How do you picture your field? Does free junk make that picture a reality? The days of "Build it and they will come" are long gone. Now you must offer them something they cannot get for free or find in Grandpas woods.

At the start, one of the most important places (in my opinion THE MOST important place) to put your money will be in building the most impressive field you can afford. Far better to have one really good field than several fields less impressive than the local junkyard.

Think of the coolest field that you have never been to but really want to visit...
Did they come to mind because of the rentals they have?
Did they come to mind because of the great air system?
Because they offer brand X, Y, or, z paint?

I bet the place that popped into your mind first is the one where you saw an awesome picture of some really cool bunkers.
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:27 AM #12
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Originally Posted by Delmarva Paintball View Post
As far as using free stuff for the bunkers... unless someone is giving away quality building materials, don't bother. How do you picture your field? Does free junk make that picture a reality? The days of "Build it and they will come" are long gone. Now you must offer them something they cannot get for free or find in Grandpas woods.

At the start, one of the most important places (in my opinion THE MOST important place) to put your money will be in building the most impressive field you can afford. Far better to have one really good field than several fields less impressive than the local junkyard.

Think of the coolest field that you have never been to but really want to visit...
Did they come to mind because of the rentals they have?
Did they come to mind because of the great air system?
Because they offer brand X, Y, or, z paint?

I bet the place that popped into your mind first is the one where you saw an awesome picture of some really cool bunkers.
What Dan said above and keeping hostile/overly aggressive players in check so they don't ruin the fun for everyone else should be at the top of your list for success.
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Old 09-11-2012, 09:44 PM #13
TeacherCreature
 
 
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The compressor is not owned by us it is local fire department, relative there fills our tanks for Sat and Sun play
We have 4 scuba tanks.
Can you cascade scubas?

I realize that we need a better system but we are just starting nad on a shoestring budget. The whole thing will be up and running for 4 or 5 thousand.
This is not to be cheap we will pour all the money made into it and grow it but we just dont have a lot to start with.

Anyway that aside I think you guys are hit it on the head and I need to come up with creative awesome fields and that seems more challenging than I thought
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:00 PM #14
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Yes, you can cascade the Scuba tanks, all of the hoses and fittings will run you about $250 or so.
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Old 09-11-2012, 10:08 PM #15
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Can you cascade scubas?
Sure, have multiple fill stations. Always have players fill off the lowest pressure tank first, then move up to the next highest pressure tank. The more separate fill stations you have with various pressure in each tank, the longer you will get "good" fills. But it's a little inconvenient. We used to do this, but only with two fill stations. We had 5 SCUBA tanks at the time I think. Once the pressure of the two tanks dropped too low for our liking, we switched the higher of the two to now be the first (lower pressure) tank and put a new full SCUBA tank into the rotation as the second "top up" tank.

At the time we didn't have all that many players on HPA and we are also a low volume paintball field. The more paint players shoot, the more air you will need. Therefore, one way to reduce the air you need is to have higher paintball prices, meaning players will shoot less paint, you will need less air, and you will probably be more profitable. That theory hinges on having good field(s) with good customer service though. A crappy field with higher prices doesn't usually do very well.
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Old 09-12-2012, 09:02 AM #16
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i would like to have average pricing and be profitable.
What is a pressure off scuba that starts to be too low?
also how many shots does a tippmann 98 get from 3000 psi in 47cuin tank
I bought 2 stations and have 4 tanks.
Im just hoping for 10-14 players each saturday and each sunday that would be great and keeping a good amount of them over the winter would be superb
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Old 09-12-2012, 03:21 PM #17
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You will get many more fills from larger tanks. You cannot get even one complete 3K fill from a 3K SCUBA tank. I would imagine the fire department compressor you are using will fill to 4.5K. Check into selling your current SCUBA and buying two bulk 4.5K tanks. You can get a decent regulator for a few hundred dollars and keep it dialed down to just under 3K. When I first started I also had a shoestring budget and this was one of the best decisions I made.

Also don't gloss over the low volume paint concept mentioned above by Reiner. Understanding your position on that issue fully now will save you lots of problems later.
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Old 09-13-2012, 09:46 AM #18
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Low volume field = charge more for paint so people use less?
counter the negative image with great fields?

Do I have that about right ?
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Old 09-13-2012, 11:45 AM #19
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That's the basics. There is a lot more to the philosophy of low volume paintball fields but Reiner is better at driving that point home than I am.

I suggest doing a search for some of his posts where he clearly spells it out. Also look at his blog, lot's of good insight there.
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Old 09-13-2012, 04:05 PM #20
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I understand the idea and I will look them up my only fear is that a well established place with awesome fields is an hour away and if I price to high im afraid to lose players, although its easier to lower prices than raise em, and an hour is an hour so i dont know gonna read those posts now
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Old 09-19-2012, 07:01 PM #21
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if you run wood ball game limit the time to 10min play. have your refs call out times after 5 min. things heat up and they throw more paint. Invest in a compressor. look for used equipment. i own AAA paintball park in constantia n.y. which i took over in march. Yes plan on spending money to get things going but do research on other parks and see what they are charging
if you want any other advice look me up and give me a call ill be glad to give advice
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