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Old 02-22-2012, 08:00 PM #106
xXTLXx Kryptonite
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Originally Posted by TMarquie View Post
Interesting priorities here...defend yourself and bash your customers. Almost 2 years and over 13000 views on this post, and its contents, and not one positive customer experience has been posted on your behalf. Now that's something to be proud of!
Can you not read? I actually posted that I had a good experience with this company.
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Old 02-22-2012, 08:01 PM #107
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Squares – All good points, and you may be right. Some will view this response as a “screw up” while other might now say I was not only willing to defend myself personally, but also the actions I have taken while representing Alpha Sports. People seem to overlook you have people on here making comments of trying to track me down and come to my home. Out of curiosity, how would you handle that? To me that crosses any business line when someone makes these threats. Like I mentioned before I do not believe this thread has really done much. We are work with highly repeatable customers and companies daily and we are hoping for a great industry turn around. I am fully confident that anyone contacting Alpha Sports will receive excellent customer service, years of knowledge to assist, and a great product.

TMarquie – There are positive remarks on pbnation about our company. The trouble is happy customers are generally the ones that just go about their business. Very seldom do you see threads or posts where people post praise after praise. I’ll give exception to xXTLXx Kryptonite. Thanks for the honest response to your order. It was a pleasure working with you. Ever hear a complaint about us from the RPL, PSP, Military, any colleges, etc, etc? That’s because all of them are satisfied customers that return over and over. Now, if you can all of a sudden become a “victim” well now that’s juicier gossip … even if you fudge some details and in the end the story becomes a lot of untruths it makes for much better posting.

Anyway, I have made a public offer to any and all that have made the above claims. It is is all I can really do.
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:08 PM #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSportsPB View Post
People seem to overlook you have people on here making comments of trying to track me down and come to my home. Out of curiosity, how would you handle that?
Honestly? You're absolutely right that this crosses a line. Business is business, period. Good business, or bad business... doesn't matter.

First, some context:

The internet provides anonymity, so it's rather common for pitchfork toting mobs to spring up when no one actually has to follow through on their part of the "call to arms". Again, not taking sides... but let's say that hypothetically, their claims are true... and that your company has somehow cheated them out of money or services. Civilized human beings operating as a business would then take this into the appropriate court system. You would then have the opportunity to present your case, and defend yourself. We could call this an atechnological norm between businesses (or just "how businesses dealt with eachother before/outside of the internet"). This is likely how one of your larger customers would handle such a dispute.

It doesn't sound like you're dealing with big businesses here though... it sounds like you're dealing with individuals. It may be a huge assumption, but I think fair to assume that a purchase like the one we're talking about consumes a larger amount of an individual's available resources, and therefore, they're more emotionally invested in these types of transactions.

Basically, you have an upset customer, who isn't a business, and they're not going to follow the established norm for how businesses handle this sort of dispute. That, coupled with the relative anonymity of the internet, and you create the propensity towards the angry, pitchfork-toting mobs.

So, how would I handle that... Assuming this was me: I would step back a second and take this all in. We're not talking about businesses who aren't behaving like businesses... we're talking about (pissed off) people, who are behaving like pissed off people. If possible, I'd try to reach out to each person individually and try to understand their entire situation to the best of my abilities. Specifically, I'd ask "what is it, that this person is going through that's making the process go as badly as they FEEL like it is." Noting the word "feel" there. It might have absolutely nothing at all to do with the service you provided, or the product... but some combination of things that extends out far beyond your isolated business relationship with them. If it were me... hell... I'd probably offer to buy the guy a beer and ask if they wanted to sit down and sort this out in a way that works out for both of you. This really would be targeted to the people who are personally affected by this... not the rest of the mob that are just tagging along for the ride... I'd work my *** off to let them know that I'm not just a business, but I'm a person too, and that I care that they're upset and genuinely want to try to fix that if I can. If I can't, then I want to work to make them understand that the issue lies outside of our relationship, and try to offer some suggestions for how they might address those issues if I could. At the end, I'd hope that I built a relationship with another human being that they felt good about, and maybe then they wouldn't choose the path of hunting me down at my home address.

I wouldn't... under any circumstances... tell my customer that their complaints are BS (valid or not). Telling someone that their complaint is bull**** basically ends the possibility for civil discourse because you totally demean their perspective. That may not be your intent... but I get the impression that you got pretty emotionally invested in this conversation as well, and that might be driving your communication style.

That said, All of this is under the HUGE assumption that this tier of customer is of value to you. If they're not of value, and they're really not impacting your bottom line in any way at all... then I'd just take notes, and let it die. Engaging in a conversation just creates targets for them to pick apart, and adds fuel to the torches. If someone did actually appear at your doorstep, and you chose not to take a more personal approach, you could just get the authorities involved and take things down that road... but personally, I'd rather take the personal approach... That way, if someone was paying me a visit at my house, I'd be more likely to be greeted by a handshake and a smile.

disclaimer: This is all totally my personal opinion, and not the view/recommendation of my company... I'm just reaching out to a guy on the internet, and giving him some advice... guy to guy.

Let me know if you want to grab a beer and shoot the **** about all of this. Happy to share my thoughts.
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Old 02-23-2012, 08:40 AM #109
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Square - I appreciate your points. I think they are very valid, but more so if you are living in a perfect world. Unfortunately when you involve that word “feeling” you can throw all logic and common sense right out the window when dealing with any customer large or small … and for the record I value every customer from the ones that buy a single case of paint, to the indoors spending large amounts to open their business for the first time with netting, turf, etc etc. A customer is a customer and we do everything possible to ensure our customers are happy.

The internet providing anonymity I think can be both a good thing and a bad thing. There are instances where the public needs to know about a business or event that is truly doing the unthinkable. However when a 16 year old picks up his ipad, laptop, or smart phone (all of which are just handed to kids now so they don’t understand the value of anything) and begins to bash a company at random claiming they made a purchase and had their money stolen, when they facts are they might be the distant relative of a guy that made an order, canceled it and got a refund. That’s when it becomes an issue. When that same person starts calling on others to look up a person’s address and go to their home to “knock a lung loose”, then you have crossed another line entirely. There is no “business” in this situation.

Here is where it gets tricky … when that same person becomes a bolstering add for a competitor, he now tries to line himself back in the business field. This may be all over-analyzing but I tend to just look at that as something to hide behind. I am well aware our company has competitors and am proud to say we work very well with 95% of them. Even the ones we don’t work well with I am proud when they completely model their websites as a form of attack ad against us. Never has been my cup of tea but hey, if that’s what you have to do. If I am out of or cannot provide a product I will make a good reference to where the customer can go to get what they need, even if this means I lose the sale. I think that is big in customer service.

I will say with those I was able to identify I have reached out on a business level as much as they will let me before posting anything in this forum. I will not however sit idly by while lies are told and I am threatened. I would not expect anyone else here to just sit and watch as they have threats passed on them. I believe it is responsible to follow up on the claims that have been made and seek that resolution. That is my entire reason for joining pbnation and I will now seek an active role customer questions, problems, etc.

Just to mention what you said about disputes. I highly advise everyone to use a card when making a purchase. You always have protection this way should something go wrong with a purchase. Someone mentioned PayPal a ways back but to the best of my knowledge I don’t believe PayPal is a bank or bound by the same security stipulations as a bank … even though they issue debit cards (go figure).

Also while typing this I want to say that I was contacted this morning by phone by EL Jefe GIP. It was great to talk to him and he went over with me that he had placed an order that was never received. As I stated in my response to him, when he sends me a doc showing a chargeback was filed I will send him a roll of netting on me. I think we were actually able to track down who he spoke with here (no longer employed) and I will be looking into any emails sent during this order time. In addition I plan to stop in and see him next month to shake his hand and offer an in person apology. I’m sure he is deserving of a beer as well.
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Old 02-23-2012, 09:41 AM #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSportsPB View Post
When that same person starts calling on others to look up a person’s address and go to their home to “knock a lung loose”, then you have crossed another line entirely. There is no “business” in this situation.
Honestly, if someone said that about me in a public forum, I'd probably get my local law enforcement involved... Even if they think you're the worst businessman in the world (which, it really doesn't sound like is the case...) that's conspiracy to commit a crime.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:34 AM #111
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Lee did a GREAT JOB!

What a battle!... i am not discrediting anyone's story here but i own 5 different business and i know that image is important and there is nothing more in the world that i hate the most and that is the fact that when people are happy they RARELY post comments or anything but when they are ANGRY.. man... they open up accounts just to bad mouth you and tell all their friends and family and even their dog!..

SO .. i will place a VERY positive post for ALPHA SPORTS in particular LEE.

I actually placed a $31,000.00 order with Lee 2 months ago. And good thing i didn't read the posts because i probably wouldn't have placed that order since 31k fund transfer from my account would have made me a bit nervous!.. hehe.

Anyhow. I got ALL my items on time, and although i am not finished installing them all they all seem to be fine.. lets just hope the wind does not blow it away

In FACT the only problem i had with my order was the actual FREIGHT company that didn't have anything to unload the 9000 pound package of their truck.

LEE was very helpful throughout the whole process and has always answered my calls, provided me with any information i needed and been very courteous with me at all times.

For those who are doubtful, don't be! Alpha Sports was great to us and we highly recommend it...

Well i do have one complaint actually.. reading these post i see that so many of you got free stuff sent back and forth.. LEE! i spent 31k.. where is my free roll of net?? LOL..
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:49 PM #112
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First, Thank You for posting your experience. You guys have been great to work with and if you need anything while working on your install please let me know.

I only wanted to make one comment on the “reading these post I see that so many of you got free stuff sent back and forth”. Since my posts I have only received 1 phone call from a legitimate complaint. I honored my word and sent a roll to that customer. I also plan on making a personal stop by his field next month to make sure all is well.

It’s amazing how this thread was started by kid that was not even a customer, and fueled by our competitors. I only hope we are showing that Alpha Sports does truly take care of its customers. If there are any legitimate complaints I do want to know about them. 888-729-1115.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:51 PM #113
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I have no fight in this whole thing but i will say im impressed with how alpha sports has handled it. kudos to them!
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Old 02-29-2012, 03:38 PM #114
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Originally Posted by jesus01 View Post
I have no fight in this whole thing but i will say im impressed with how alpha sports has handled it. kudos to them!
Other than these types of comments:
Quote:
It’s amazing how this thread was started by kid that was not even a customer, and fueled by our competitors.
Stop trying to blame others... Only talk about what you are going to do... stop complaining that "the other kids are picking on me..." Does not sound too professional.
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Old 03-12-2012, 08:58 PM #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaSportsPB
EL Jefe GIP – You state you placed an order, did not get anything at all, and were hung up on. I don’t believe you are serious at all but I will offer the same thing to you. Call me. Let me know what the order was. I am sure we still have it on file if it was actually placed. You’re your complaint is legit and you placed and order and show where you had to file into your bank I will give you a free roll of netting on me.
Delivered on his word. Thanks Lee
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:01 PM #116
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I look forward to meeting you.

Glad your event went well.
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Old 03-15-2012, 09:37 AM #117
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Glad to see these issues being worked out.

Lee,
As for your other statements regarding me, I'm just going to let it go. I wrote a whole rebuttal at extravaganza, but this isnt the place for a pissing contest. I'm just happy to see people being taken care of.
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Old 03-15-2012, 10:30 AM #118
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First off...I have ZERO experience with Alpha and business in general. The title of the thread caught my eye and I've read every post, long winded to just a sentence or two.

Lee - Very stand up of you to publicly say what you have. Forgive me, but I had a preconceived image of you just by what people were saying. I now feel otherwise.

I'd also like to point out as a general observation that the tone of posts have changed significantly throughout the entire thread. It seems as though that as soon as the Alpha account was created and this Lee fellow started posting, people had no harsh and abrasive things to say. Fingers were not being pointed and positive experiences were posted. That's a little ironic...

In conclusion, I'd like to thank Alpha and Lee for shedding some light on this mess. I do not own a field and will not be a customer but I can tell you that if anyone I know needs any field supplies, I'll send them your way.
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Old 03-15-2012, 11:22 AM #119
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Just my 2 cents, I have netting from both Alpha Sports as well as K-Pro. These were bought from Kee Action Sports as their premium netting. The netting that was shipped from K-Pro has exceeded my expectations and has weathered great. Wish I could say the same for the Alpha Sports Netting. I purchased what I was told was a "premium" grade of netting only to believe it was the economy grade. I have my netting on a pulley system so it can be let down at the end of the day. This netting is in my opinion a poor quality netting and it rips extremely easy. It is time for more netting here at my field and I will only be looking in one direction. Just a further note, I do not have experience personally with Lee as to say anything about his character. This is just my opinion on the products received.

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Old 03-16-2012, 08:24 AM #120
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ck028 - Thanks for the comments. We have received a lot of positive responses from this.

warzone – I am sorry to hear there was an issue. If you would, please give me a call 888-729-1115 ex 701. I would like to be able to look up your order and see if it was the premium or economy netting you received. Our premium material should hold up for a long time, while the economy was designed to be more of a budget option netting. Let me see if I can get the roll replaced for you.
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Old 03-16-2012, 01:35 PM #121
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Good for you Joe! An adult response. Ok, question? Now your "premium" netting "should hold up for a long time" but on your web-site you claim a life expectancy of 14-22 years! Which is it? As far as offering a "budget option netting" why sell something that won't work?
Addressing posts, some almost 2 years old, I say too little too late if you are as big in the industry as you claim.
People being taken care of? Ok and the check is in the mail, those pants don't make you look fat, yada yada yada.
And by the way buying Imported Fabric from one company, having it shipped to another company to sew it and add edging and grometts does not make it "Made in USA". Starting with and keeping up Truthfulness and Honesty is much better than having it catch up to you.
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Old 03-16-2012, 02:31 PM #122
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nobrokenballs - We offer 3 styles of netting Economy, Premium, and Professional. Economy serves as kind of a catch all for field divider netting and those just looking at price alone. We get a lot of calls for people just wanting something for their backyard to off in a field somewhere. They don’t care about ASTM specs or insurance, just bottom dollar. Who said it didn’t work anyway? In my opinion I never care for selling the economy stuff but there is a need in the industry for it. Why ignore that?

Our premium netting does have a 14-22 year outdoor UV treatment. I would call this a long time wouldn’t you? No company can guarantee their netting to last X number of years because we cannot control how the netting is installed by the customer. I have seen people take a roll of netting and nail or staple it to a tree to hold it up causing damage to the roll immediately. There is no way to guarantee how long that will last. If every field installed their netting per the ASTM installation guide I suppose you could come up with a better actual life span for netting. I have seen some fields still using the same netting they purchased from us 10 years ago, while some fields don’t make it 2 years. You need to take into account wind conditions and installation factors.

I made my best effort to address all points, 2 years old or recent. I am sorry this does not fit your description of being good enough. However the list of emails, pm’s, and phone calls I have received seem to speak volumes of what others think. While there is no way to please 100% of everyone, we are doing all we can to see satisfied customers.

I am not sure where you get the imported netting and shipping here and there from. Our netting is USA made, and fabricated all in 1 location.

Just to add this in, I see you created your pbnation account and have made only two posts, both derogatory towards Alpha Sports. In addition you seem to at least think you have a lot of knowledge about us. This makes me wonder, are you a past customer? Competitor? If you are a past customer, and have a legitimate issue, please call me. The fastest way to a resolution is direct contact. I find it more likely you are one of our competitors. In that case, this is just sad.
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Old 06-29-2012, 03:35 AM #123
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When I started reading the messages on this forum I found it so unbelievably interesting that it was like a good book.... I couldn't put it down.
I am 40yo and have been in business for 20years. Some lessons are learned the easy way but most the hard way. It is a shame that human nature generally holds us to the "... if you have a good experience you tell 2-3 people, but if you have a bad experience you tell 7-8 people.... so on and so forth..".
The shame in that is that a good company gets run into the dirt over someones else's displeasure with them. This is a clear case of defamation and yes it is very childish. Again "like a good book (or should I really say bad book).
Is it unprofessional to banter with customers? I really do not see any future customers here. There may be one or two but if they had an ounce of maturity they would find bashing Alpha Sports in the manner in which it was done as a sure sign that there are underlining issues. I was really pulled in by this drama when the one man started talking about and giving the advice to Lee about not defending himself. Some times just saying "I'm sorry you feel this way...etc.." isn't enough when being attacked professionally and more importantly personally. It is usually pretty easy to make the accusing party look like a fool. Self defense is always warranted. This Thread could have 100 negative posts and 100 dissatisfied customers, but there could be 10,000 happy and satisfied customers on the other side. Lee I suggest you put a "Review" button on your website. That way as a satisfied customers orders and all is well he can quickly hit the 5star and go on with his life but yet let the inquiring customers know he was happy and pleased with your product and services.
I am for one a "HAPPY CUSTOMER". I am a bit disappointed that Lee has not offered to come to our outreach and give tips and training, but I can live with that.
The product that we ordered was exactly as described and Lee even lowered the price point to help meet our budget so that we could get a better grade netting so help with the welfare of our kids and families. We were taken to the cleaners by another paintball supply company ( I will not mention any names, but we bought from them via Amazon) and we left negative feed back via Amazon. That was the proper place to do so. I called another suppler mentioned on this thread and the gentleman did not give me the time of day. Now may be he is a very busy guy and didn't have time for a small price point customer like ourselves. My order was less then $2000. Netting, combiners, and cable for one field. May be his dog died or worse a family member was hurt and he was attending to them...? I could not know so therefore leaving a negative comment about him would inappropriate.
I have written to much so I will end with this.
Lee I can not thank you enough for the help you have given to us. The product you provided is exceptional. Your prices, though not the cheapest was fair and honest and I appreciate your willingness to work with us to get the netting we needed without pricing us outside of safety. Shipping was right on time. I will order our next netting orders from you and I look forward to doing so.
You treated us like a long time customer even though it was our first order with your company. We will be a long time customer.
Here's your STARS *****
Be Blessed,
P.S - Lee, If you can figure out who this is please call me and arrange a personal meeting.

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Old 06-29-2012, 08:59 AM #124
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Old 06-29-2012, 12:59 PM #125
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Old 06-29-2012, 01:24 PM #126
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left a message for their sales team to buy a big order of turf and netting. Waiting for the call back so I can record and grill them about stealing money. I'll see if I can fish out a working phone # or address of theirs
Go read the thread (in its entirety) and then go sit in a corner facing the wall.
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