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Old 04-14-2012, 09:09 AM #1
rukux
 
 
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Clone gt leak

In the beginning I was cleaning the drivetrain, taking off the factory lube and putting on a thin coat of lube. I then gas up the gun and dry fire it and it was shooting at low velocity. I originally thought I did something wrong with the drivetrain, not putting enough lube in a certain area. As I degas the gun and fired the last shot, I notice that the bolt was still forward and I couldnt lift up the drivetrain cap up, I hold the trigger down again to see if it would fire the last shot of air and it didnt. I then put my finger through the feedneck and push back the bolt and i can hear the rest of the gas come out through the ASA. So when I took the drivetrain out and inspect it again and put a little more lube on where I think it should be. Then I gas it up and still got the same result. I remember reading a thread here someone had to increase the velocity, so I did that and dry fire some more and then the velocity would drop down again and I increase it again. But this time I thought I heard gas leak when I turn the velocity up. I wasnt so sure about it but I decided to do a test leaving the gun aired up, the tank was at 1000psi and I come back in 4 hours and tank psi is at 500 now unless my eyes are playing tricks with me .

So I took the drivetrain out again and inspect it but I didnt see anything wrong. I decided to dry fire it once again and suddenly I can hear a gas leak coming from trigger frame area. I then fired once more and the air leak stop, I then dry fired again and then the gas leak come back.

I have clean and relube the bolt switch oring(016), replace the valve 3x oring 017, took the solenoid out and to see the oring and they look fine to me.

can anyone give me an idea what i should do? I ran out of air so I cant do anymore test until sunday. lol

here is a picture from where i hear the leak in this area. where the arrow is pointing, but thats the general area.
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Old 04-14-2012, 05:01 PM #2
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if you feel confident carefully take the gun apart and see if you can see any tell tale signs of lube being blown away from a leak area.

check that the o-ring between the fram and sublpate, reg and subplate are sorrectly seated and have no pinch signs.
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Old 04-14-2012, 06:40 PM #3
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Why macroline is better than macroline-less. That plus the weight.
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Old 04-14-2012, 06:49 PM #4
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Why macroline is better than macroline-less. That plus the weight.
Really? Maybe we should move all the internal air passages and use tons of houses on the outside of our guns. Please stick to the PE forum with the other kids that think there geo2 is different from a g4.
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Old 04-14-2012, 07:06 PM #5
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Really? Maybe we should move all the internal air passages and use tons of houses on the outside of our guns. Please stick to the PE forum with the other kids that think there geo2 is different from a g4.
Considering I've been using MacDev since before it was cool, I deplore your fanboy comment. I don't see why Macroline-less is desirable if it adds weight and complexity. My macrolines have never caused issues and never gotten in my way. But, when these come down on the used market in a few months, I won't be above snagging one.
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Old 04-14-2012, 07:13 PM #6
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Clean and relube the manifold. Replace orings if necessary make sure your using the stock lube they give you
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Old 04-14-2012, 08:59 PM #7
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Saying macro>macroless is like saying auto cocker 3way hoses>internal air passages.
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Old 04-15-2012, 01:13 AM #8
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thank you guys for the help, i will test this out.

- james , i dont see any sign of lube being blown away. and i took a look at the solenoid and the subplate "b" oring they look fine to me.

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Originally Posted by jyh916 View Post
Clean and relube the manifold. Replace orings if necessary make sure your using the stock lube they give you
this is a stupid question but is the manifold = the solenoid? and relube these oring?


i took off the solenoid, one thing i saw different is that in the manual it shows subplate screws, and i dont have any of them. not having the subplate screw could this cause the leak?




pulling out the subplates "b"


under the subplate
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Old 04-15-2012, 01:23 AM #9
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james i have 1 question. if i havnt fired a shot for like say, in a while or in 5 minute is it normal for the first shot to have low velocity and the second shot is at normal velocity?
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Old 04-15-2012, 01:58 AM #10
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Rukux you should definately have this screws in the sublate, if you send me an email I'll make sure you get some.
The screws missing should not cause a leak as the frame will hold that subplate down.
You could try using two screws from the wrap to hold the subplate down, put the gun back together and test with air. just wipe some lube on the o-rings and re assemble. If it is still leaking the extra lube will leave a tell tale sign where the leak is coming from.

Quacker - 11 months I would have agreed with you but after having the GT in my hands it's cleaner looking and much more comfy for changing hands on my favorite gun ever!
Macro line is definately not trouble free, you can get niggly little leaks just from pushing on it, hose gets scored from pulling it apart, dirt etc etc.

We chose to make the gun a touch heavier due to more detail on the milling, it could actually be lighter without the macro line fittings.
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Old 04-15-2012, 07:23 AM #11
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Originally Posted by James@MacDev View Post
Rukux you should definately have this screws in the sublate, if you send me an email I'll make sure you get some.
The screws missing should not cause a leak as the frame will hold that subplate down.
You could try using two screws from the wrap to hold the subplate down, put the gun back together and test with air. just wipe some lube on the o-rings and re assemble. If it is still leaking the extra lube will leave a tell tale sign where the leak is coming from.
do you mean put the lube on the solenoid oring and the subplate oring?
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Old 04-15-2012, 08:16 PM #12
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yes do that, also make sure you check and lube the orings under the front reg.

one last thing to check while the front reg is off, is there is a small oring on the big screw in the centre of the reg?

remember to check all the o-rings to make sure there is no deformation.
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Old 04-16-2012, 12:14 AM #13
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i sent an email.

Hey james, just an update i took out the regulator screw and the inline reg, but the reg didnt budge, i didnt want force it to hard scared of breaking something . what i did today was i replace the oring 1x17 in the subplate "b" even though the original one look fine, i put a medium coat of lube on the bolt switch oring, spacer inner oring, and the valve oring and thin coat in the inside valve, and put a noticeable coat on the DT outer oring 020. clean and relube the piston oring and piston shaft and lube the retainer outer oring.

at this time i didnt do the test suggested by you yet.

today i went to the field and showed my teammate the clone gt and told them about the problem. they gassed up the gun and still had the leak, so they decided to fired about 20-50 shots (dont know the velocity, didnt have a chronograph) anyway. After the first set i didnt notice any leak anymore but wasnt 100% sure, and i let someone else fired about the same amount and my teammate told me theres no more leak and i didnt hear it also.

so come to conclusion i still dont know what cause the problem in the first place. maybe a certain oring that needed to be set in placed

now i took the gun apart and lube and inspected the subplate and solenoid just encase there was any leak would occur.

also i would like to ask is it normal if i have not fired the gun in awhile the first shot the ball would just roll out or fall few feet forward and the 2nd, 3rd and ect shot would be at normal velocity? and another question i would like to ask is in the manual it say to lube the bolt keg bore i just lube the inside correct? and do i lube the inside of the valve?
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Old 04-16-2012, 01:50 AM #14
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James, since there is talk about the solenoid and maniforld, what are the specific oring sizes for them? Are they the same ones like the vx manifold?

Aside from the reg or drivetrain, I can't find info on any other gt oring sizes.

I blew my asa oring for example and replaced it, but I couldn't recall what specific size it was nor can I tell if it was the same one as the previous version. All I knew was that it stopped the leak.

Quote:
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also i would like to ask is it normal if i have not fired the gun in awhile the first shot the ball would just roll out or fall few feet forward and the 2nd, 3rd and ect shot would be at normal velocity? and another question i would like to ask is in the manual it say to lube the bolt keg bore i just lube the inside correct? and do i lube the inside of the valve?
I had something similar (velocity issues after leaving it for a while) as well but I relubed the reg to how macdev does it and solved the problem so far.

Last edited by dak22 : 04-16-2012 at 02:23 AM.
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Old 04-16-2012, 08:26 AM #15
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dak22, this might help. I took the time to disassemble and measure/compare yesterday, and compiled an oring list.

http://www.macdev.net/forum/showthread.php?tid=9
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Old 04-16-2012, 03:52 PM #16
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dak22, this might help. I took the time to disassemble and measure/compare yesterday, and compiled an oring list.

http://www.macdev.net/forum/showthread.php?tid=9
Thanks, that exactly what I was looking for. Yeah the info on the reg and drivetrain is exactly like jint's thread on top, but lacked the other information you just posted. Really appreciate the effort.
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Old 04-16-2012, 04:36 PM #17
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i sent an email.

Hey james, just an update i took out the regulator screw and the inline reg, but the reg didnt budge, i didnt want force it to hard scared of breaking something . what i did today was i replace the oring 1x17 in the subplate "b" even though the original one look fine, i put a medium coat of lube on the bolt switch oring, spacer inner oring, and the valve oring and thin coat in the inside valve, and put a noticeable coat on the DT outer oring 020. clean and relube the piston oring and piston shaft and lube the retainer outer oring.

at this time i didnt do the test suggested by you yet.

today i went to the field and showed my teammate the clone gt and told them about the problem. they gassed up the gun and still had the leak, so they decided to fired about 20-50 shots (dont know the velocity, didnt have a chronograph) anyway. After the first set i didnt notice any leak anymore but wasnt 100% sure, and i let someone else fired about the same amount and my teammate told me theres no more leak and i didnt hear it also.

so come to conclusion i still dont know what cause the problem in the first place. maybe a certain oring that needed to be set in placed

now i took the gun apart and lube and inspected the subplate and solenoid just encase there was any leak would occur.

also i would like to ask is it normal if i have not fired the gun in awhile the first shot the ball would just roll out or fall few feet forward and the 2nd, 3rd and ect shot would be at normal velocity? and another question i would like to ask is in the manual it say to lube the bolt keg bore i just lube the inside correct? and do i lube the inside of the valve?
if you are experiencing FSDO like that you can you use the board to tune it out until the gun wears in.

for the bolt keg lube the front inner o-ring and the bore where the bolt switch rides.

the inside of the valve does not need any lube!
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:46 PM #18
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dak22, this might help. I took the time to disassemble and measure/compare yesterday, and compiled an oring list.

http://www.macdev.net/forum/showthread.php?tid=9
does the clone gt manual give diagrams and sizing for the manifold and everything? The manual is not up on macdevs site and i dont own one so i am not sure. when it does become available i can update my thread on orings with the info.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:22 PM #19
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Jinx18 No it does not show those sizes.... at least not my manual.

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Old 04-17-2012, 01:28 AM #20
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thanks James! i think i might just got another small problem not big though..

this looking spring /wire or screw grip came out of the hole where you screw in the solenoid. Both got loose, the front one is loose but holding in for now, but for the back solenoid screw grip its gone. as you can see from this picture.


this is where it is.
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Old 04-17-2012, 09:19 AM #21
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The threads pulled out?
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