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View Poll Results: Issues or Concerns with Michigan Paintball.
Fields/Stores: Options, Operation, Conditions, etc. 14 29.17%
Staff: Owners, Operators, Refs, etc. 8 16.67%
Teams: Cheating, Elitism, Favoritism, Behavior, etc. 19 39.58%
Cliques: Inclusion-Exclusion, Alienated, etc. 21 43.75%
Location: Distance, Travel-time, Area, etc. 17 35.42%
Community: Age, Conduct, Sportsmanship, etc. 11 22.92%
Cost: Recurring playing 23 47.92%
Desegregation: (Advanced/Beginner) Separation by X,Y,or Z 12 25.00%
Future: Direction the game is heading. 11 22.92%
None of the above, Michigan paintball is perfect. 0 0%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-23-2011, 04:48 PM #1
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Exclamation Improving For 2012

Lets be constructive!

While Paintball is slowing down for the winter lets take a minute to focus on next season and how to improve our facilities, image, and even ourselves to be as appealing and marketable as possible for 2012. This is meant to benefit, not to befoul. Please keep personal attacks, trolling, and biased opinions to a minimal. Thanks.


After years of visiting fields in our great state and speaking to hundreds, if not thousands, of players over the years, I would like to see the communities input; More specifically, the concerns. This is meant to serve as a tool to all (Owners, Players, Operators, Staff, Etc.) and NOT to segregate a specific field(s) and or store for scrutiny. Listed are the most common reasons behind players leaving, as well as "new(er)" players not returning or playing less frequently. Though not all scenarios are listed, these seem to be the most common amongst past and present players.

There are many players that are still active that to which many of these apply to. These may not be a determining factor on whether a players leaves the game but may still be considered an issue to the community. Offending others is not something many are comfortable with doing, but then again sometimes you must endure the growing pains to ensure a better quality of play and the future of our beloved game.

Poll is ongoing, multiple selecting is allowed, and the votes are private.
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Last edited by Caitiff : 12-23-2011 at 05:07 PM. Reason: Poll is ongoing, multiple selecting is allowed, and the votes are private.
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Old 12-23-2011, 07:00 PM #2
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I think that us veterans need to work on our interactions with new/beginner players. I have made some kids days before when they show me there beginner gun and you give them a complement on it. Show them some respect and make them feel like the gear they have is great and they will be happy and proud and come back even more!
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Old 12-24-2011, 11:21 AM #3
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I think that us veterans need to work on our interactions with new/beginner players. I have made some kids days before when they show me there beginner gun and you give them a complement on it. Show them some respect and make them feel like the gear they have is great and they will be happy and proud and come back even more!
Well said
I have played ALOT of places over the years and have always felt its the veterans job to help newer players. Anything from giving good advice of paint to shoot, markers and maintenance to making or whatever else they might need help with.
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Old 12-24-2011, 11:27 AM #4
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Damn true there. Everyone at a paintball field/store/event is part of the decision of that newer or brand new player to play paintball again. Sure the staff has the biggest impact and we have some great fields and staffs here in Michigan, but the other players make an impact too.

Whether it's telling the new kid that he had a great shot, or that his gear will do just fine... offering him a spot on 'your team' for that game... or just letting them know they can ask you any questions they have.

I've found that as you walk around looking 'veteran' a lot of the kids parents stop to ask you questions as well, and how you treat them will influence how many future paintballers we have as well.

It's not like a lot of effort is required. However as we all know, when you're trying something new for the first time, surrounded by people you don't know... a small thing to make you feel welcome goes a long way.

Oh yeah, not shooting the crap out of them helps too!
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Old 12-24-2011, 08:15 PM #5
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I have heard comments from new players being intimidated by "double triggers" haha.

So yes not shooting the crap out of them

and making players who are new to "tournament" level markers to take it easy when there is new players out there.

good stuff
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Old 12-25-2011, 01:34 AM #6
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people just need to get there heads out of there ***** and realize that paintball is a game, and most of us will never get paid for. treat it like a hobby, and play for fun
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Old 12-25-2011, 11:19 AM #7
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people just need to get there heads out of there ***** and realize that paintball is a game, and most of us will never get paid for. treat it like a hobby, and play for fun
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Old 12-25-2011, 01:07 PM #8
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I'm surprised to see Inclusion-Exclusion, Alienated, etc. as being the biggest issue to improve on in Michigan Paintball. I've played at multiple fields throughout Michigan over the years and I haven't seen or heard of hardly any of this just from being around other players.

I would have thought the Cheating, Elitism, Favoritism, Behavior, etc option would have been the top choice as i've seen more of that in Michigan Paintball then anything. But nonetheless this poll I find to be pretty interesting and informative. It is for sure a learning tool that Players as well as field owners can take into consideration.
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Old 12-26-2011, 08:01 PM #9
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I'm sure many that are a part of these groups do not have any issue with feeling excluded. It would be great to see higher number of votes, since the poll is private. 30+/- sseems a bit low. Very interesting none the less to see the poll leaders. Keep up the input people.
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Old 12-26-2011, 08:15 PM #10
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Gotta look at the entire poll from a noob/rookie/rec player's perspective.
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Old 12-26-2011, 11:33 PM #11
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Gotta look at the entire poll from a noob/rookie/rec player's perspective.
X2 who cares what team players think. they shouldnt be the majority of any fields income. if they are it makes for a salty playing atmosphere.
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Old 12-27-2011, 12:26 AM #12
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X2 who cares what team players think. they shouldnt be the majority of any fields income. if they are it makes for a salty playing atmosphere.
Agreed. Seems that there are quite a few fields that have a larger team/friend based clientele than non-regular players. I imagine this is why players, new and old alike, experience the feel of exclusion at said fields.

I could not tell you how many times owners respond with a half *** solution to the concerns expressed about 'teams' or 'regulars' creating an unwelcoming atmosphere for players.

I guess my thought on the matter is; Would you rather lose 5+/- players, multiplied by how many are guilty of this behavior, that create this atmosphere or let these actions continue and potentially lose their numbers ten fold (possibly more, depending on the impact of their behavior)?

As Msonic said about looking at this from a new players point of view, most that are veterans in the game feel this at new or less visited fields from certain players, or for whatever reason. Imagine being completely new to this and greeted with the same. Players that have been around would shrug it off and say "F that guy", which is I would do... but many would not. Nobody likes to be excluded, and nobody would voluntarily subject themselves to this.
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Old 12-27-2011, 07:28 AM #13
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I guess I am not shocked to see the results. Switching to another field gives you the same result.

Different area, different building, same atmosphere.

I feel anguish for new players and the paintball community as a whole.

Will the average player's perspective change after viewing these results? Probably not... It's probably the more or less retort of "This doesn't apply to me"
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Old 12-27-2011, 09:16 AM #14
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Will the average player's perspective change after viewing these results? Probably not... It's probably the more or less retort of "This doesn't apply to me"
the sad part is most business owners are guilty of the same thought process
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Old 12-27-2011, 11:15 AM #15
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I'm sure many that are a part of these groups do not have any issue with feeling excluded. It would be great to see higher number of votes, since the poll is private. 30+/- sseems a bit low. Very interesting none the less to see the poll leaders. Keep up the input people.
Also keep in mind a lot of mi ballers dont look at pbn or only do so infrequently.

Ive been to some fields where the clique thing is very prominent. Yet other fields with similar player demographics dont foster the same ****. I cant imagine new players would ever want to come back and play if they felt excluded like that.

Long ago i remember showing up to a field wearing my matching dye jersey/pants and rocking my mechanical cocker.. the kids at the field refused to let me play because "you look too good" despite offering to use my tippmann and explaining how gear doesnt maje the player they excluded me from playing. so I had to sit around for 4hrs unable to play, waiting to get picked up, after paying the field entry fee and buying paint.. Needless to say I never went back to that field. Worst pb related experience ive ever had.
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Old 12-27-2011, 11:31 AM #16
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Old 12-27-2011, 05:11 PM #17
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Also keep in mind a lot of mi ballers dont look at pbn or only do so infrequently.

Ive been to some fields where the clique thing is very prominent. Yet other fields with similar player demographics dont foster the same ****. I cant imagine new players would ever want to come back and play if they felt excluded like that.

Long ago i remember showing up to a field wearing my matching dye jersey/pants and rocking my mechanical cocker.. the kids at the field refused to let me play because "you look too good" despite offering to use my tippmann and explaining how gear doesnt maje the player they excluded me from playing. so I had to sit around for 4hrs unable to play, waiting to get picked up, after paying the field entry fee and buying paint.. Needless to say I never went back to that field. Worst pb related experience ive ever had.
I can't tell you how many times this has happened. This logic applies at almost every field. If you're wearing a jersey... you are a pro to the camo wearing people.

I know people who have purchased gear and have never stepped onto a field. During their first game, they were moved to other team to balance out. Needless to say, moving him didn't receive the results people had imagined.
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Old 12-27-2011, 06:52 PM #18
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I can't tell you how many times this has happened. This logic applies at almost every field. If you're wearing a jersey... you are a pro to the camo wearing people.
Which I in turn (yea... bias...) use for our advantage. I take that opportunity to become a mentor for each new arrival every day of play I attend. By the end of their time spent, they are thanking the *pro/pbnation guy/Mike* for all the help and support they given. I have kids and parents alike shaking my hand.

I guess, each of us speedball apparel wearing players, have to find within ourselves on each day of play to utilize our visually elevated stance on and off the field for good. It's up to us to become the ambassadors our field needs to not just survive, but flourish.

Think that is too much for everyone to chip in on and be consistent with? I guess we can just Not do it and see where the numbers end up...? in the end, I thought paintball was about fun...for everyone. Fostering such an environment can only have a positive impact on everyone around us from Owners to Staff, and Players to Visitors.

We do make fields money, and we can destroy them also. The choice is ours if we want to remain a vital part of Michigan's fields.
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Old 12-28-2011, 10:31 PM #19
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New players are the future of the sport, hands down. Welcoming and making them feel a part of the pb community are huge. When I'm done playing for the day, instead of keeping the little paint I have left only to rot away, I look for the younger kids still playing and give it to them. Sure, it's not a lot but it always lights up a face or two and is a positive for all. Remember, all of us were beginners once.
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Old 12-29-2011, 05:33 AM #20
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Gotta look at the entire poll from a noob/rookie/rec player's perspective.
Yea, I started thinking about it that way after you seeing what you wrote and in that case it does put a whole new perspective on it.

I see that cost is now in the lead by one vote. That has been an "issue" for years ever since Paintball had this influx of kids into the sport. I mean you gotta figure marketing to a demographic that can't afford it doesn't really make any sense. To me Paintball is considerably cheaper then when I started playing back in 1996, so cost isn't that big of a deal.
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