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Old 05-22-2011, 10:40 PM #1
underpressure69
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refs on field 2

there wasa few refs that was on field 2 that was just rediculous. the number 32 on field 2 was terrible pulling pointless penalties jsut beucase he can. if you want you can contact me danny rhodes. 502-553-1325
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Old 05-22-2011, 10:57 PM #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by underpressure69 View Post
there wasa few refs that was on field 2 that was just rediculous. the number 32 on field 2 was terrible pulling pointless penalties jsut beucase he can. if you want you can contact me danny rhodes. 502-553-1325
this........
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Old 05-22-2011, 11:24 PM #3
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LSD-Savage played on field 2 today and had no such prob.

Danny your right the refs pull penalties because they can, they have a job to do.
If your team lost posting on PBN is not going to change it.
Dont think that we had the refs on our side as we got calls made on us to.
We even got warnings about the fans that we had being to loud.
All in all Danny stop the *****in and go get better at paintball.
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Old 05-23-2011, 01:11 AM #4
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the issue is not just a team losing because of calls. the truth is that we pay a PREMIUM price to play a NATIONAL EVENT and for that price we expect the best and we have every reason to.

the refs at this event were seriously lacking, i should not have to beg a ref to check me, a one for one should not be pulled on me for asking for a paint check. the fact is these refs did not even know the rules i heard two of them say they didnt know yellow was a protected color. I have played local tournaments with far better reffing, and if this issue is not taken care of then these divisional teams are going to stop showing up and that is an issue.
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Old 05-23-2011, 07:10 AM #5
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first a ref does NOT have to go in and check you if you request it...second if you were shot in an obvious location (and easily verifyable) and you ask for a check...its a one for one

its the players responsibility to get out when hit...its the refs responsibility to make sure the player gets themselves out and if they dont they assess penalties
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Old 05-23-2011, 08:17 AM #6
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^^^ If the player ask for a check on themselves in an in obvious area that ref is REQUIRED to check that player that ask for it! The rules state that and so did Mr. Perez.
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:21 AM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ?DevilDog? View Post
^^^ If the player ask for a check on themselves in an in obvious area that ref is REQUIRED to check that player that ask for it! The rules state that and so did Mr. Perez.
Please don't comment if you have not read the rule book.
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11.05 Paint Checks. Paint checks are performed by Referees for the purpose of determining if a paintball has broken on and marked a player. Paint checks are performed by a Referee when the Referee has observed a player taking shots, or when shots are directed into an area occupied by a player that the Referee cannot directly observe, when the physical location that a paintball may have broken on is not visible to the Referee, or when the Referee is directed to do so by another
Referee.
(1) Player Requested Paint Checks. Referees may, but are not obligated to, perform a paint check after a player has requested one on another player.
(2) Flag Carriers. No flag carrier will ever be stopped for the purposes of performing a paint check, unless requested by the flag carrier.
(3) Not Easily Verifiable. Players, who are hit in obvious locations, which are not easily verifiable, such players may call for a paint check.
This is direct from the 2011 NPPL Rule book.
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:28 AM #8
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Not that I want to defend DevilDog, but you failed to highlight the entire rule - the key component you missed is "requested one on another player".

I believe in this case the player requested it on themselves. Now, having not been there, the question is was the hit obvious? Then the follow-up question would be in a place that could be easily verified or not?

If the hit was easily verifiable and the player called for a check it could still be considered playing on. However, if the hit was in a location that the player could not easily verify and he had no teammates around him that could verify then a paint check is required - assuming he did not continue to shoot his marker while waiting for the paint check he should be pulled if marked out, but no one for one called. If he failed to ask a teammate to check him, continued to shoot his marker while waiting for a paint check or was hit in an easily verifiable location he should have been called out and a one for one assessed. IMO
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:31 AM #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox4paintball View Post
Not that I want to defend DevilDog, but you failed to highlight the entire rule - the key component you missed is "requested one on another player".

I believe in this case the player requested it on themselves. Now, having not been there, the question is was the hit obvious? Then the follow-up question would be in a place that could be easily verified or not?

If the hit was easily verifiable and the player called for a check it could still be considered playing on. However, if the hit was in a location that the player could not easily verify and he had no teammates around him that could verify then a paint check is required - assuming he did not continue to shoot his marker while waiting for the paint check he should be pulled if marked out, but no one for one called. If he failed to ask a teammate to check him, continued to shoot his marker while waiting for a paint check or was hit in an easily verifiable location he should have been called out and a one for one assessed. IMO
That is the entire rule on Paint checks in the Rule book, nowhere dose it state weather or not they are required to check someone who calls a paint check on them selves.
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Old 05-23-2011, 09:36 AM #10
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face it the ref's suck in every sport that involves ref's, sorry lifes a *****
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Old 05-23-2011, 10:23 AM #11
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face it the ref's suck in every sport that involves ref's, sorry lifes a *****
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Old 05-23-2011, 10:25 AM #12
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We had a couple instances with bad refs on field two. Worst one was a player had a small splatter of paint about 1mm wide by 1 inch long with no shell on his hopper, wanted the ref to know that it wasn't a hit so he called a paint check on himself, ref didn't even go over and just called a one-for-one with no paint check. That is a bit ridiculous. same game we had a guy pulled because he had bunker rub on his hopper with no shell and he got pulled.
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Old 05-23-2011, 10:31 AM #13
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Honestly the reffing on field wasn't great the whole event. There was a shortage of refs (saw 6 the whole time), rarely were people being checked on the inside of the field, having no sideline room gave them little room to maneuver and made them more hesitant to get on the other side of the player. Everyone is going to see a bad call/ no call once in a while but what sucks is seeing people getting cheated because the refs just weren't active enough.
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Old 05-23-2011, 10:38 AM #14
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Here is the thing. You need to be able to react to reffing. If you see they are calling things one way your team should adjust. You will never get perfect refs. But what you can do is see trends and adjust so you don't fall victim to them.
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Old 05-23-2011, 11:03 AM #15
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imo they got progessivly worse, but hey realize your playing paintball everything sucks
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Old 05-23-2011, 11:09 AM #16
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Quote:
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We even got warnings about the fans that we had being to loud.
Was this specifically about them being loud during the 10-second start time? We had some problems with the crowd causing teams to jump because they were trying to be supportive at the wrong time. University of Michigan got the ten-second warning and were ready to break out when one of thier supporters yelled "Go Blue!". Three of them had to tag back up and so they got a bad start. Just a fan trying to be supportive. Another more mischevious fan (actually, it had to have been another player because of the side they were standing on) yelled "GO!" before the head ref did and caused a team to jump. They were livid. That was on Saturday, so after that we put effort into not allowing the fans near the starting boxes before the games and to trying to get the fans to be quiet before games so we didn't have more of those kinds of problems. I wasn't part of that conversation, but I don't think there would be a problem with loud fans during the point, the markers are louder than them.
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Old 05-23-2011, 11:26 AM #17
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Was this specifically about them being loud during the 10-second start time? We had some problems with the crowd causing teams to jump because they were trying to be supportive at the wrong time. University of Michigan got the ten-second warning and were ready to break out when one of thier supporters yelled "Go Blue!". Three of them had to tag back up and so they got a bad start. Just a fan trying to be supportive. Another more mischevious fan (actually, it had to have been another player because of the side they were standing on) yelled "GO!" before the head ref did and caused a team to jump. They were livid. That was on Saturday, so after that we put effort into not allowing the fans near the starting boxes before the games and to trying to get the fans to be quiet before games so we didn't have more of those kinds of problems. I wasn't part of that conversation, but I don't think there would be a problem with loud fans during the point, the markers are louder than them.
no more of us being loud duirng the game...not coaching just yellin yaaaaa or wooooooooo **** like that....
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Old 05-23-2011, 11:40 AM #18
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I think the shortage of refs was the biggest problem, having played years of psp (as well as being a certified PSP ref) there is usually a 1:1 ratio of refs to players on the field. I dont think NPPL needs 14 refs on the field but on field 2 (having 6 refs) I know they worked hard, but lack of bodies allowed so many missed calls which DID affect game outcomes in MANY instances! Missed calls which could have been prevented my more refs turned into penelties, in turn again affecting games....
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Old 05-23-2011, 12:20 PM #19
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We found the refing to be lacking. Mostly they did not know the 2011 NPPL rules. All of my guys know all of the rules and they arnt refing, you would think that the refs would also know the rules. The chrono ref flicking the triggers of the markers to check for bounce? If you have your set screw tight against your micro switch for a short pull of course it might shoot again when you flick it. But who the hell shoots their gun by flicking the trigger? The other major problem I found was anyone could play for any team. As long as you had a players wrist band on to get into the gate (and even then you could just walk in) you could play for what ever team you wanted to. Isn't the chrono ref suppose to check NPPL I'ds? Not once did they check on field 2. What the hell do we pay for them for? Other than a few other things we think the event went good. Oh and we got 3rd so I am not complaining because we lost. We didn't even get a plenty the whole event. This is constructive cridisisim for the NPPL to help make it better.
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Old 05-23-2011, 12:25 PM #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zigg View Post
We had a couple instances with bad refs on field two. Worst one was a player had a small splatter of paint about 1mm wide by 1 inch long with no shell on his hopper, wanted the ref to know that it wasn't a hit so he called a paint check on himself, ref didn't even go over and just called a one-for-one with no paint check. That is a bit ridiculous. same game we had a guy pulled because he had bunker rub on his hopper with no shell and he got pulled.
you dont need shell to tel if its a hit.

what I assumed happened...is since the ref was called in...he determined (his opinion) it was a valid hit...the player called for a check on an easily verifyable obvious hit so assed a one for one. Bad call that it was a hit? maybe...bad call for the one for one? not if he thought it was a hit...it would then be the correct call
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Old 05-23-2011, 12:35 PM #21
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Overall I'd give the reffing on field 2 a 6 out of 10. They hit most of the calls but one ref pulled more one for one's than I've ever seen. The guy with the red, white, and blue dumb hat thing. I saw him pull two 1 for 1's on pack hits which are defined as un-obvious hits so you can't pull a penalty. Then there were a few occasions were the player would get shot in the upper body/shoulder area, the player who shot him would tell the ref where he was shot and they would pull him after a minute, which is clearly playing on but there was no penalty. So there just needed to be more consistency. I mean for only running two fields there should be quality refs available since your not stretched thin with 6 fields. Brightside of all the 1 for 1's is the schedule was always on time.
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