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Old 08-08-2009, 10:04 PM #43
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If the universe always existed, then our laws of thermodynamics are wrong. For the universe to collapse back on itself, gravity has to counteract the momentum of expansion. Gravity is too weak to do this in our universe.
What if dark energy is in fact driving the expansion of the universe as it has been suggested? It is possible that dark energy is subject to the same effects of entropy, and it would eventually become unusable, allowing gravity to take over.

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Also, isn't the expansion of the universe slowing?
Speeding up, in fact.
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:10 PM #44
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Yes, all energy will eventually become completely unusable. Atoms will cease to vibrate and the temperature in the universe will approach but never actually reach absolute zero.
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Old 08-09-2009, 12:01 AM #45
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Gravity is another factor I forgot to ask about. After energy becomes in some stable satate, whether its mass or energy, wont there be some kind of gravitational pull to "crunch" it all together?

And does energy have mass? I know even photons have some kind of mass to them so...
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Old 08-09-2009, 12:15 AM #46
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not sure if engery has mass or not but i do now one thing, light is effected by gravity.
EX: a black hole. it has such a hugh gravitnal pull that not even light can escape it.this shows that if light can be effected by gravity it almost asured that every thing can.
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Old 08-09-2009, 12:36 AM #47
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It's interesting the type of information and questions that come out of this website.

The answer to the question is anything with mass has energy. The E=mc^2 isn't the complete equation however, it is the most widely used equation in particle and relativity physics.
The full equation is E = m * gamma * c^2.

gamma = 1 / Sqrt(1 - v^2 / c^2)

This basically states that anything with energy has a mass and a momentum.

Click here for more info

So by using the full equation if an object has no mass as photons are theorized to, they still have a relativistic speed or momentum.
It's been two years since I had this class and used this stuff but that's basically what I can remember. This leads to Schrodinger equation and further expansion of particle physics.
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Old 08-09-2009, 01:35 PM #48
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It's interesting the type of information and questions that come out of this website.

The answer to the question is anything with mass has energy. The E=mc^2 isn't the complete equation however, it is the most widely used equation in particle and relativity physics.
The full equation is E = m * gamma * c^2.

gamma = 1 / Sqrt(1 - v^2 / c^2)

This basically states that anything with energy has a mass and a momentum.

Click here for more info

So by using the full equation if an object has not mass as photons are theorized to, they still have a relativistic speed or momentum.
It's been two years since I had this class and used this stuff but that's basically what I can remember. This leads to Schrodinger equation and further expansion of particle physics.
I don't have any credentials in physics beyond getting an A in high school physics, but doesn't e=mc^2 only mean that anything with energy has an amount of mass that is equivalent to it, not that everything with energy actually has mass?
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"Unless we can make the philosophic foundations of a free society once more a living intellectual issue, and its implementation a task which challenges the ingenuity and imagination of our liveliest minds, the prospects of freedom are indeed dark. But if we can regain that belief in power of ideas which was the mark of liberalism at its best, the battle is not lost." - F. A. Hayek

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Old 08-09-2009, 04:55 PM #49
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Yeah but photons break the rules if I remember correctly.
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Old 08-09-2009, 05:18 PM #50
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Well theoretically, for that equation to be universal anything with energy would need to have mass and vice versa.
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Old 08-09-2009, 05:44 PM #51
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No, photons do not have mass, but they do have momentum. The proper, general equation to use is E2 = m2c4 + p2c2 So in the case of a photon, m=0 so E = pc or p = E/c. On the other hand, for a particle with mass m at rest (i.e., p = 0), you get back the famous E = mc2.

This equation often enters theoretical work in X-ray and Gamma-ray astrophysics, for example in Compton scattering where photons are treated as particles colliding with electrons.
Straight from nasa website. I thought I remembered correctly.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:07 PM #52
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The soul experiment was very very poor. When you die, various gases and fluids escape, that's what the 21 grams would have likely been. When you die, the brain ceases to have electrical function thus you cease to exist. There is no "life force" outside of that.
Actually that is incorrect. In the experiment, the man does the same tests with dogs and people. The 21 grams is the difference between the humans total loss of weight and the dogs. Hence humans have a soul, life force, etc that dogs do not have.

Note I am not saying this is true. Just explaining what the guy said was true.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:12 PM #53
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What if dark energy is in fact driving the expansion of the universe as it has been suggested? It is possible that dark energy is subject to the same effects of entropy, and it would eventually become unusable, allowing gravity to take over.



Speeding up, in fact.
I have no idea if it would be possible. No one knows.

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Eventually the temperature will hit absolute zero.

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I don't have any credentials in physics beyond getting an A in high school physics, but doesn't e=mc^2 only mean that anything with energy has an amount of mass that is equivalent to it, not that everything with energy actually has mass?
The mass-energy equivalence dictates that mass can be turned into energy and vice versa. See: nuclear weapons. Einstein's theory was directly responsible for nuclear weapons to be created.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:13 PM #54
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Actually that is incorrect. In the experiment, the man does the same tests with dogs and people. The 21 grams is the difference between the humans total loss of weight and the dogs. Hence humans have a soul, life force, etc that dogs do not have.

Note I am not saying this is true. Just explaining what the guy said was true.
The guy was wrong either way, it has never been replicated.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:18 PM #55
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The guy was wrong either way, it has never been replicated.
I wasnt aware that someone had even tried to replicate it. Do you have a source for a failed attempt?
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:24 PM #56
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I wasnt aware that someone had even tried to replicate it. Do you have a source for a failed attempt?
Not of the top of my head.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:29 PM #57
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The guy was wrong either way, it has never been replicated.
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Not of the top of my head.
I'm going to make the logical guess and assume this experiment is without thorough sources or ran by reputible management. You're attempting to discredit a shady experiment with another shady experiment. Makes sense.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:30 PM #58
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I'm going to make the logical guess and assume this experiment is without thorough sources or ran by reputible management. You're attempting to discredit a shady experiment with another shady experiment. Makes sense.
Or I don't feel like spending the next hour on google looking for a needle in a haystack. Either or.
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Old 08-09-2009, 06:37 PM #59
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Or I don't feel like spending the next hour on google looking for a needle in a haystack. Either or.
So says Samuel Shenton. I hope someone will get that allusion.
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Old 08-09-2009, 11:39 PM #60
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Eventually the temperature will hit absolute zero.
No, it will never reach absolute zero. However, it will be close enough that the difference will be negligible as far as physical processes are concerned.
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