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Old 07-29-2009, 08:54 PM #1
Rhino1XL
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Exclamation Legend Spring mod testing!

Preliminary testing has started with my modified spring. Initial testing is being performed with a Legend,V2 parts and a Tadao board. Initial tests with the MODIFIED spring has allowed a 50 psi DROP in input pressure!
(stock dwell is being used.... around 8 to 10ms)

Chrono results with the modified spring needed a 50 psi DROP to get the FPS back to where the stock spring had it. (under 300 fps)

Testing is underway tonight.....More to follow.

Also the marker has shown less kick than with the stock spring.

PM me for Legend springs.

Rhino
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Old 07-29-2009, 08:58 PM #2
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im very interested.
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Old 07-29-2009, 10:41 PM #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhino1XL View Post
Preliminary testing has started with my modified spring. Initial testing is being performed with a Legend,V2 parts and a Tadao board. Initial tests with the MODIFIED spring has allowed a 50 psi DROP in input pressure!
(stock dwell is being used.... around 8 to 10ms)

Chrono results with the modified spring needed a 50 psi DROP to get the FPS back to where the stock spring had it. (under 300 fps)

Testing is underway tonight.....More to follow.

Also the marker has shown less kick than with the stock spring.

PM me for Legend springs.

Rhino
Vids would be appreciated.

I wouldn't start selling springs if you haven't got any big information yet.
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Old 07-31-2009, 03:29 AM #4
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Does this inclued the popet spring? if so I am interested. I already have the lightest ram spring posible.
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Old 07-31-2009, 10:53 AM #5
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Efficiency numbers? And max rof comparisons between this spring and the stock spring?
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Old 08-01-2009, 01:08 PM #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueb2k View Post
Does this inclued the popet spring? if so I am interested. I already have the lightest ram spring posible.
there is no poppit in a legend.

Efficiency numbers? And max rof comparisons between this spring and the stock spring?

6 pods using about 2000 psi on a 68/45... on a full fill 13 pods will test further this week.

dwell ten

no rof difference, just as fast both ways.

noticeable difference is less kick and quieter shot.
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Old 08-02-2009, 01:28 PM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedAkuma View Post
there is no poppit in a legend.

Efficiency numbers? And max rof comparisons between this spring and the stock spring?

6 pods using about 2000 psi on a 68/45... on a full fill 13 pods will test further this week.

dwell ten

no rof difference, just as fast both ways.

noticeable difference is less kick and quieter shot.

The legend is a poppet valve marker.



And that sounds like pseudo-science.
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Old 08-02-2009, 01:39 PM #8
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i want to see a vid
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Old 08-02-2009, 01:58 PM #9
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there is a cup seal in a legend with a spring....Bob long used poppets. lol

this mod is of the main spring only
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Old 08-02-2009, 03:37 PM #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asdffdsaasdf View Post
The legend is a poppet valve marker.



And that sounds like pseudo-science.
the legend is a FASOR...not poppet
and for those of you that dont know...
Forward
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FASOR
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Old 08-02-2009, 05:04 PM #11
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Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by asdffdsaasdf View Post
The legend is a poppet valve marker.



And that sounds like pseudo-science.
Psuedo science, like global warming.....

This spring is a custom wound spring that was origionally developed for shockers. The fact that it works well with Legends is purely a coincidense. Someone pointed out to me that it should work with Legends, and so I gave a tester one, and low and behold..... it works!

YES, the Legend is a FASOR marker (like a DP Fusion), and it has a poppit "style" valve. No valve spring is included with the new spring. A number of Legend owners have contacted me and will be recieving their new springs this week. I'm sure that they'll post up their results here on PBN like Red Akuma has.

No video has or will be made by me. Surely one of the new spring owners will in the near future.

Take care,
Rhino
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Old 08-02-2009, 08:07 PM #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by killinwithaquest View Post
the legend is a FASOR...not poppet
and for those of you that dont know...
Forward
Air
Spring
Operated
Return

FASOR
FASOR only describes how the rammer is moved ... The legend is still a poppet marker.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhino1XL View Post
Psuedo science, like global warming.....

This spring is a custom wound spring that was origionally developed for shockers. The fact that it works well with Legends is purely a coincidense. Someone pointed out to me that it should work with Legends, and so I gave a tester one, and low and behold..... it works!

YES, the Legend is a FASOR marker (like a DP Fusion), and it has a poppit "style" valve. No valve spring is included with the new spring. A number of Legend owners have contacted me and will be recieving their new springs this week. I'm sure that they'll post up their results here on PBN like Red Akuma has.

No video has or will be made by me. Surely one of the new spring owners will in the near future.

Take care,
Rhino
As with most things, this mod will have both positives effects and drawbacks if done incorrectly. The biggest issue i see is a slowing and or inconsistancy at high rates of fire. Which may or may not be an issue with PSP's rules down to below 15bps.

I'm just against someone coming in, declaring "IT WORKS!", and offering to sell them in this forum. Thats all.
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Old 08-03-2009, 02:49 AM #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhino1XL View Post


YES, the Legend is a FASOR marker (like a DP Fusion), and it has a poppit "style" valve.
Dude. It's a poppit.

Timmies, cockers, excals, vikings, bushies, egos, spyders, angels, And Legends Are all variations of stacked tube poppit valve guns. The first being the Sheridan.

So it's not a poppit "style".

That's what it is. A poppit. That's how it works.

Fasor represents the ram method.

I'm not sure that what your dealing with is all that great if you can't even say what type of valve is in the damn gun.

Glenn put some serious R&D into the legend. I'm sure he tried some different springs. Sounds like you found a weaker one. Lower pressure, quieter shot.

Typical side effect is lessened efficiency.

Like in the Bob Long Vice low pressure POPPIT!
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Old 08-03-2009, 08:31 PM #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fossilhead View Post
Dude. It's a poppit.

Timmies, cockers, excals, vikings, bushies, egos, spyders, angels, And Legends Are all variations of stacked tube poppit valve guns. The first being the Sheridan.

So it's not a poppit "style".

That's what it is. A poppit. That's how it works.

Fasor represents the ram method.

I'm not sure that what your dealing with is all that great if you can't even say what type of valve is in the damn gun.

Glenn put some serious R&D into the legend. I'm sure he tried some different springs. Sounds like you found a weaker one. Lower pressure, quieter shot.

Typical side effect is lessened efficiency.

Like in the Bob Long Vice low pressure POPPIT!
DUDE.... I wasn't arguing !
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Old 08-03-2009, 09:49 PM #15
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Pming you about testing.
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Old 08-04-2009, 07:09 PM #16
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Old 08-04-2009, 08:26 PM #17
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Old 08-04-2009, 11:03 PM #18
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so any final test results yet?
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Old 08-04-2009, 11:54 PM #19
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This weekend! Looks great so far.....
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Old 08-05-2009, 03:04 AM #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fossilhead View Post
Dude. It's a poppit.

Timmies, cockers, excals, vikings, bushies, egos, spyders, angels, And Legends Are all variations of stacked tube poppit valve guns. The first being the Sheridan.

So it's not a poppit "style".

That's what it is. A poppit. That's how it works.

Fasor represents the ram method.

I'm not sure that what your dealing with is all that great if you can't even say what type of valve is in the damn gun.

Glenn put some serious R&D into the legend. I'm sure he tried some different springs. Sounds like you found a weaker one. Lower pressure, quieter shot.

Typical side effect is lessened efficiency.

Like in the Bob Long Vice low pressure POPPIT!
The boblong vice poppit is lengthened and allows more air to pass through over a longer period. It's a mechanic dwell of sorts. Hince why the efficiency is worsened. It's not so much the weaken spring.
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Old 08-05-2009, 04:12 AM #21
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Originally Posted by nightkast939 View Post
The boblong vice poppit is lengthened and allows more air to pass through over a longer period. It's a mechanic dwell of sorts. Hince why the efficiency is worsened. It's not so much the weaken spring.
Understood.

Point is, whenever you're reducing the hpr pressure, the pressure put behind the ball (as was claimed with this spring mod), you're going to need more air to get it to velocity. Resulting in lessened efficiency.

Whether it's a spring, a poppit, or what-have-you, the same physics apply.

Seems 200ish psi and a dwell of 8ms (varies, but that's a ballpark) is the best efficiency point for most stacked tube poppit guns. You drop that 50psi, you need the valve open longer. Either by mechanical means (lp poppit) or by upping the dwell on the gun.

::edit::
I guess the reason a weaker return spring would up the fps of a legend is because it's not restricting the ram as much. It was popular amongst BKO owners a while back to put their fasor return springs in a vice so they were compressed, hit them with a torch for a bit, and leave them for a day. The idea was to weaken them, allowing for lower hpr levels, smoother shot, and letting them shoot brittle paint. BUT they still lost efficiency. It's not a huge deal. You're talking a pod. But still, it's hard to believe a claim that you can lower your hpr, keep your dwell, and have no change in efficiency. The balance is off. But whatever. Enjoy your magic springs.
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