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Old 02-22-2008, 02:14 PM #85
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so many angry people on this thread. wouldn't want u guys carrying guns
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:16 PM #86
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This isn't for people under 18, it's already illegal to carry a concealed firearm if you're under 21.
I'm totally for conceal carry on college campuses. Having a rule that says "no firearms on campus" won't stop suicidal crazies from shooting people. It WILL help prevent other students from fighting back.
Fun fact: Indiana will issue a handgun license to anyone over 18 that allows it them to carry it concealed or not. (This is not the same as a CCW)
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:26 PM #87
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It would be like opening Pandora's box. An utter hell hole. Everyone would live paranoid of everyone else, knowing that under their shirt was piece of metal that could instantly kill them and many others. A wrong look could set someone off. An accidental shove could set someone off. There would be daily shootings because of people misreading others.

There would of course be situations where it would be beneficial. But you have to consider the negative consequences that would ensue.
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:29 PM #88
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I would be all for it. I don't currently carry, nor do I even own a handgun, but I am looking to buy in the near future, and will most likely get my CCL.

As long as students meet all the current state requirements (age, training, etc.) and then the schools requirements, for example: registering the firearm with campus police, not being allowed to carry anywhere alcohol is present, etc., I see no problems with it. At least in the case of Ohio, most students couldn't carry to begin with. You have to be 21 to purchase a handgun and apply for your CCL, which eliminates probably 2/3 to 3/4 of the student population (i.e. restricts it to the theoretically more mature).

Basically, what's the difference between going to class and possibly having someone carrying concealed sitting next to you, versus, going to the gas station and having a guy in line behind you concealed carrying? There are definitely two sides to this argument though, and both are probably equally valid.
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:32 PM #89
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:37 PM #90
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If students could carry guns nobody would try and kill X amount of people because they know everyone else would shoot them. Therefore, no more school shootings.
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:39 PM #91
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I think allowing guns on campus violates the very principles of higher education. Turning the university campus into a free-fire zone would be a mistake, and would likely only result in 100 people being killed instead of 30. Think about it, the moment someone starts shooting, everyone is just gonna start shooting. There is no way to distinguish the school shooter from the people trying to stop him.
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:59 PM #92
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I think we should, it seems now that if you plan to shoot up the school you most likely will so just being able to bring a gun to school won't make a difference.
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:04 PM #93
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There is no way to distinguish the school shooter from the people trying to stop him.
The dude shooting unarmed civilians would be a good way to distinguish.
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:05 PM #94
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I'm 100% for it; would pretty much eliminate school shootings.

However I think it should require an additional permit with a CCW.

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Old 02-22-2008, 04:14 PM #95
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no, 95% of people under 18 are not mature enough to have a gun, period


If anyone in your class was smart enough to use that statement it would have ended the discussion right there!
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:30 PM #96
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So the topic of allowing students to carry arms to class as a deterrent of the mentally unstable with guns came up in class today. At the end of the day, no one had a realistic solution

What's yours?

Forgot to mention, this would apply to college campuses, not high schools
The school should actually spring for armed guards, or better that more campus police. Failing that they should arm the teachers.
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:50 PM #97
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I think allowing guns on campus violates the very principles of higher education. Turning the university campus into a free-fire zone would be a mistake, and would likely only result in 100 people being killed instead of 30. Think about it, the moment someone starts shooting, everyone is just gonna start shooting. There is no way to distinguish the school shooter from the people trying to stop him.
you must have never been shot at....the first few times you are, you tend to find cover ASAP!!! your first instinct is not to make like John Wayne and go for the hip......even USSS agents worry that if the time comes if they would be able to jump in font of a gunmen.......so i would have to say your theroy won't hold much water in that asspect.......now if you want to go with the angle of people pulling the trigger under stress/fire and hitting a bystander that would hold water......
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:52 PM #98
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SOOOOOOOOO many idiots in this thread.

1) 11 US colleges and universities, including all public universities in Utah and Colorado State, allow licensed concealed carry on campus. In over 60 semesters (that's 30 school years), they have had: zero gun crimes, zero gun accidents, and zero gun thefts. Would those of you saying the campuses would turn into war zones care to explain why it hasn't happened at the 11 schools more awash in permitted gun owners than any others in the nation?

2) Concealed carry on campus is already legal in 20 US states. Only one state FORCES individual colleges to allow it, but it's already legal in 20 states. No CCW licensees have ever committed a school shooting.

3) Pay attention to this one: THESE INDIVIDUALS ALREADY CARRY THEIR HANDGUNS EVERYWHERE ELSE! They carry them to the grocery store, the shopping mall, the movie theater, the bank, their offices, etc. You pass them every day. In most states the rate of licensed concealed carry is 1-2% of eligible adults. That means, in a packed movie, there are probably 3-5 people carrying guns in there with you. At the mall, there might be 30 people carrying legal concealed handguns. They are trusted to behave responsibly EVERYWHERE except campuses. Why do you think they will suddenly turn into homicidal lunatics just because a university owns the grass they are walking on, instead of a shopping mall?

4) In most states, concealed carry licensees have been shown to be 5-10 times LESS likely to commit any sort of violent crime than a random member of the population. Statistically speaking you are FAR safer in a room full of CCW license holders than you are in an elevator full of strangers at work.

5) 48 states currently have CCW laws. NOT ONE has EVER repealed their CCW law, in the history of the united states. CCW holders just don't cause problems. Here in NC, CCW licensees are arrested for violent crime less often than police officers. This makes logical sense too - people who are willing to go through an expensive training course, submit to an FBI-level background check, get fingerprinted by the sheriff, and wait 3 months for their permit are conscientious, law-abiding people. The ones you should be scared of are the ones who give less than two ****s about the law, and just stick a gun in their waistband.

6) Gun-Free Zones work on the honor system. The problem is, mass murderers have no honor. The only people constrained by anti-carry laws are those who voluntarily obey - and therefore, the people who didn't pose a threat in the first place.

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Old 02-22-2008, 04:58 PM #99
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i think its absolutly rediculous that kids can carry guns on college campuses. i think there will be an increased number of confrentations, not so many large shootings like some of the more recent ones, but more one person gets shot on or off campus because your putting a deadly weapon in a college students hand. alot of them probably go out and get drunk once in a wile too so a gun in a drunk mans hand....not good.

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Originally Posted by Redzballer31 View Post
If students could carry guns nobody would try and kill X amount of people because they know everyone else would shoot them. Therefore, no more school shootings.
most school shooters kill themselves anyway, i highly doubt there gunna care is someone shoots them in the head. all in all i think is a very very bad idea
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Old 02-22-2008, 05:18 PM #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by llamajoey View Post
So the topic of allowing students to carry arms to class as a deterrent of the mentally unstable with guns came up in class today. At the end of the day, no one had a realistic solution

What's yours?

Forgot to mention, this would apply to college campuses, not high schools
I don't think saying it was a "deterrent of the mentally unstable" because if they are unstable to begin with, they don't care....

But I believe that if you are of legal age, and have your CCW permit, then you should be able to carry ANYWHERE... not just college...


What I think is stupid... is that I can legally carry at OSU.. and have! yet as soon as I am a student or faculty... I forfeit that right... excluding the stadium and other admin buildings.... you can carry on campus.
so for most states thats 21 years old, paid the fee, and have either taken the required safety class, or the shooting class.

and if you say "Well Matt, how many CCW's have stopped a mass shooting?" while there are actually documented cases of this... I would rather be a smart *** and say "How many NO GUNS ALLOWED signs have stopped mass shootings"....
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Old 02-22-2008, 06:19 PM #101
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i think its absolutly rediculous that kids can carry guns on college campuses. i think there will be an increased number of confrentations, not so many large shootings like some of the more recent ones, but more one person gets shot on or off campus because your putting a deadly weapon in a college students hand. alot of them probably go out and get drunk once in a wile too so a gun in a drunk mans hand....not good.



most school shooters kill themselves anyway, i highly doubt there gunna care is someone shoots them in the head. all in all i think is a very very bad idea
Part of getting the proper licensing for a concealed weapon is taking weapons safety courses. after having just got done with one. they pretty much hammer it into your brain that guns and alcohol mix about as well as gasoline and fire.
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Old 02-22-2008, 07:45 PM #102
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Originally Posted by Conqueror View Post
SOOOOOOOOO many idiots in this thread.

1) 11 US colleges and universities, including all public universities in Utah and Colorado State, allow licensed concealed carry on campus. In over 60 semesters (that's 30 school years), they have had: zero gun crimes, zero gun accidents, and zero gun thefts. Would those of you saying the campuses would turn into war zones care to explain why it hasn't happened at the 11 schools more awash in permitted gun owners than any others in the nation?

2) Concealed carry on campus is already legal in 20 US states. Only one state FORCES individual colleges to allow it, but it's already legal in 20 states. No CCW licensees have ever committed a school shooting.

3) Pay attention to this one: THESE INDIVIDUALS ALREADY CARRY THEIR HANDGUNS EVERYWHERE ELSE! They carry them to the grocery store, the shopping mall, the movie theater, the bank, their offices, etc. You pass them every day. In most states the rate of licensed concealed carry is 1-2% of eligible adults. That means, in a packed movie, there are probably 3-5 people carrying guns in there with you. At the mall, there might be 30 people carrying legal concealed handguns. They are trusted to behave responsibly EVERYWHERE except campuses. Why do you think they will suddenly turn into homicidal lunatics just because a university owns the grass they are walking on, instead of a shopping mall?

4) In most states, concealed carry licensees have been shown to be 5-10 times LESS likely to commit any sort of violent crime than a random member of the population. Statistically speaking you are FAR safer in a room full of CCW license holders than you are in an elevator full of strangers at work.

5) 48 states currently have CCW laws. NOT ONE has EVER repealed their CCW law, in the history of the united states. CCW holders just don't cause problems. Here in NC, CCW licensees are arrested for violent crime less often than police officers. This makes logical sense too - people who are willing to go through an expensive training course, submit to an FBI-level background check, get fingerprinted by the sheriff, and wait 3 months for their permit are conscientious, law-abiding people. The ones you should be scared of are the ones who give less than two ****s about the law, and just stick a gun in their waistband.

6) Gun-Free Zones work on the honor system. The problem is, mass murderers have no honor. The only people constrained by anti-carry laws are those who voluntarily obey - and therefore, the people who didn't pose a threat in the first place.

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Old 02-23-2008, 12:56 AM #103
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there were two hand guns and a shotgun i believe and im pretty sure they were purchased in illinois.
I could care less where the guns cam from I asked where the CCW was from? Oh that's right he didn't have one. I don't notice my handgun half the time so I know when I walk past one of you in a store you have no clue. Even when you cut in line I don't gun you down. However when things get hairy in public I remove myself and stand as far back as I can. The last thing I want to do is pull my gun in public. Also I won't shoot the guy taking your car at gun point, as long as it's your head getting splatered not mine I don't care. I carry so when I (yeah ME not the public) am in trouble I can walk away and go home. If I ever get to carry to school I won't stop the shooter from killing you not my problem, however I will get out the door and out of harms way, if the shoot gets in my way thats different. Most people I know with a CCW could careless if you die, I know I don't I care about number 1 ME.
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Old 02-23-2008, 04:17 AM #104
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I would really like to concealed carry on my campus, but I can't. There is nobody with guns on my campus. This means that if somebody wants to pull out a couple of autoloaders in the cafeteria or at an assembly, I'm as good as dead. I don't like that.
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Old 02-23-2008, 07:14 AM #105
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Has April Fools come early or is this thread serious?

How can you possibly think, more guns will equal nobody shooting the place up?

Lets delve deeper into this shall we?

A campus of 5,000 students and roughly 80 teachers.

60% of these people carry guns, the other 40% wants a gun, does not wish to have one or think it is stupid to have one.

Now lets take this 60% and get a true picture on what a normal person, with the power to kill, will do with a gun.

-**** around with it
-Threaten people with it
-Act all gangster
-Think how they will use it on someone
-How they hope to use it
-How they hope they won't have to use it

These are just a few.

Now, it has already been mentioned on the first page of this thread, "what if a fight broke out between two gun holders?".

Pretty much, one of these people WILL use their gun because they can claim self-defence or because they are just stupid and want to kill the other person.

He/she opens fire and injures/kills the person they were fighting and seriously injures or even kills a bystander.

So now thats two people in hospital because the theory is, more guns equals less crime!

YAY!

****ing stupid if you ask me but its what many people in this thread have stated.

Do you have any idea how dangerous and volatile a situation can be when a gun is involved?

Talk to any Police officer in any country and ask them what they have to do when a gun enters the equation, the **** hits the fan and you are in the **** from the get go.

Imagine SWAT storming a college campus only to find multiple suspects wielding guns, who have little to no training and have itchy trigegr fingers, someone is going to die even without the help of some nutjob shooting them.

Stupid, pathetic thread and unfortunately, typical replies from some.
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