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Old 02-21-2008, 01:01 PM #43
SI Rippers
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Originally Posted by pbmiyagi91 View Post
i wouldnt go that far
spool guns are the least reliable guns to an extent considering they have to be lubed and cleaned a lot when poppit guns are very easy to maintain and dont need to be cleaned nearly as often so if your looking for a reliable gun go for a cyborg ego or some other poppit
EVEN IF I HAD A POPPIT GUN I WOULD STILL LUBE IT AS FREEQUENLY AS I DO TO MY DM I DONT LIKE KNOWING MY GUN IS DIRTY OR COULD BE LACKING LUBE SO I MAKE SURE IT PREFORMS AT ITS BEST I LUBE MY GUN EVERY 2000-4000 SHOTS
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Old 02-21-2008, 01:07 PM #44
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EVEN IF I HAD A POPPIT GUN I WOULD STILL LUBE IT AS FREEQUENLY AS I DO TO MY DM I DONT LIKE KNOWING MY GUN IS DIRTY OR COULD BE LACKING LUBE SO I MAKE SURE IT PREFORMS AT ITS BEST I LUBE MY GUN EVERY 2000-4000 SHOTS
QFT if you treat every gun this way it will work like a dream
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Old 02-21-2008, 01:45 PM #45
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I stopped playing tourney ball in early 05... In 07 I opened up my gear bag... my proflex lenses were trashed, my gloves smelled and were funky... my Halo was dead... and with a new 9 volt my DM4 ripped like the day I put it away. I cleaned it, lubed it, and put a case of paint through it just for ****s and giggles, then put it away again.
Last week my buddy made plans to go to Skirmish. Back to the gear bag I went... lenses still trashed.... gloves... DM4 worked like a champ. F all the DM haters out there.
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Old 02-21-2008, 02:47 PM #46
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I've owned both DM and PM guns and I have to say they are by far the most reliable markers I've had the pleasure of shooting. With my ego, first day the feedneck broke, second day I noticed the rear QEV was leaking, played with it like that for a few months and when I tried to remove it, it broke. I cursed the day I traded my PM6 for that ego. I haven't had any problems with my Dye guns and I will probably stick to my DM6 until I can afford to upgrade to a newer DYE gun. And why would I wanna bother with QEVs, barbs, or hoses when its all self-contained in a matrix?

As far as the bounce is considered, I noticed that the UL frame on my PM6 did have a bit of a bounce but only in PSP mode. You have 2 options: A) new board B) playing in Millenium, problem solved.

And I'm sorry if you dont want to spend an extra 2 mins lubing your gun, I personally like it because I get a feel for how my gun operates and I can better maintain it when I know EXACTLY how it looks on the inside.

And as far as playing in the cold, making SMALL adjustments can work wonders.

IMO, the Matrix is one of the best markers ever made and while it has some downfalls, just like any other marker, its benefits FAR outweight its shortcomings.
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Old 02-21-2008, 03:02 PM #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by okie_hotrod View Post
I've owned both DM and PM guns and I have to say they are by far the most reliable markers I've had the pleasure of shooting. With my ego, first day the feedneck broke, second day I noticed the rear QEV was leaking, played with it like that for a few months and when I tried to remove it, it broke. I cursed the day I traded my PM6 for that ego. I haven't had any problems with my Dye guns and I will probably stick to my DM6 until I can afford to upgrade to a newer DYE gun. And why would I wanna bother with QEVs, barbs, or hoses when its all self-contained in a matrix?

As far as the bounce is considered, I noticed that the UL frame on my PM6 did have a bit of a bounce but only in PSP mode. You have 2 options: A) new board B) playing in Millenium, problem solved.

And I'm sorry if you dont want to spend an extra 2 mins lubing your gun, I personally like it because I get a feel for how my gun operates and I can better maintain it when I know EXACTLY how it looks on the inside.

And as far as playing in the cold, making SMALL adjustments can work wonders.

IMO, the Matrix is one of the best markers ever made and while it has some downfalls, just like any other marker, its benefits FAR outweight its shortcomings.
This last post had been very helpful to me. I've been reading up on this thread for quite some time and have been reflecting my decision of purchasing a Dye marker several months ago. I hate myself for saying this but it seems that I get bored sometimes with my equipment and I am constantly looking for new and other markers. It's not that I don't like the current gun I have, but it's just my nature to want something new all the time. I got the urge the other day to trade my DM for an Ego and now I don't think I will. Perhaps it's the fact that I am in the Dye section of these forums but I think it's safe to say that I am glad I made my purchase and I don't think I will ever be caught without a Dye/Proto marker. Sure I would love to try out new stuff, but I'm happy with my DM.
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Old 02-21-2008, 03:22 PM #48
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haha i'd take it out of your sig then. and yeah im always going to keep my PM6. ill try new things but i will always know i can go back to it
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:23 PM #49
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The reason people don't like DM's and PM's is because they require a lot more maitenance than poppet valve guns.

They CAN be reliable IF you: check the o-rings before you play, replace any questionable ones, and lube the multiple pieces of the bolt. If you do this before everytime you play, you will have a reliable gun.

The problem is that most people don't want to have to go through all that trouble constantly. Why should you pay $1400 for a gun and have to break it down and clean the entire thing everytime you use it?

It's much easier to wipe off the bolt and put a few drops of oil on the rammer (the case with poppet guns). Not to mention Hyper 2's (along with CP regs) are the most overrated hyped-up regs on the market. I've never seen a DM/PM get a solid +/-4 consistancy.

Don't get me wrong, DMs and PMs are definitely the smoothest shooting guns out there, but is that really going to do you any good? Sure it feels good to shoot, but its not like your hands would be shaking violently with any other gun that's not a DM...

And to the people that say efficiency doesn't matter-You just don't know what it's like to play back with a 45/45 tank...Some people can barely play front with a 45/45 on a DM. With a protege, borg, or a nice ego, you could definately get a hopper and 6-7 pods off a 45/45. If you're using more than that per game (especially in x-ball), then your team is doing something terribly wrong.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:40 PM #50
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The reason people don't like DM's and PM's is because they require a lot more maitenance than poppet valve guns.

They CAN be reliable IF you: check the o-rings before you play, replace any questionable ones, and lube the multiple pieces of the bolt. If you do this before everytime you play, you will have a reliable gun.

The problem is that most people don't want to have to go through all that trouble constantly. Why should you pay $1400 for a gun and have to break it down and clean the entire thing everytime you use it?

It's much easier to wipe off the bolt and put a few drops of oil on the rammer (the case with poppet guns). Not to mention Hyper 2's (along with CP regs) are the most overrated hyped-up regs on the market. I've never seen a DM/PM get a solid +/-4 consistancy.

Don't get me wrong, DMs and PMs are definitely the smoothest shooting guns out there, but is that really going to do you any good? Sure it feels good to shoot, but its not like your hands would be shaking violently with any other gun that's not a DM...

And to the people that say efficiency doesn't matter-You just don't know what it's like to play back with a 45/45 tank...Some people can barely play front with a 45/45 on a DM. With a protege, borg, or a nice ego, you could definately get a hopper and 6-7 pods off a 45/45. If you're using more than that per game (especially in x-ball), then your team is doing something terribly wrong.
Haha, dude... you're dead wrong. I just told you guys how my DM4 worked and has worked flawlessly after leaving it in my bag for two years. I've never, since I owned the gun, opened it, and inspected and relubed every oring before I played. They ARE NOT harder to maintain than any other gun. Thats just mis-information.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:50 PM #51
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poppits are not nearly as good performing guns as spools are. the dm is so much smoother to shoot, which in turn provides better stream accuracy. with an ego you get decent accuracy but not like i did with my dms that i have had. which is why im getting rid of my sl and getting another dye gun.

all in all its just a matter of preference. i would prefer to do a little maintenance on my gun and blow faces off as compared to doing no maintenance and getting mediocre performance.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:57 PM #52
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the hyper is the best reg out there IMO i've never seen a DM shoot more than +/-4 except when someone put the wrong insert in their barrel so i have no idea what big t25 is talking about
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Old 02-21-2008, 05:09 PM #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by okie_hotrod View Post
And why would I wanna bother with QEVs, barbs, or hoses when its all self-contained in a matrix?
word you would much rather have a cluster**** of wires in the frame and 20+ orings to take care of, and a gun that will leak if its not lubed right.

you my man need an angel. no qevs no hoses just the reliability of a poppet with 100% of the air passages milled into the body. wdp is where its at!
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Old 02-21-2008, 05:12 PM #54
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angels = yechh!! :p
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Old 02-21-2008, 05:16 PM #55
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Does the marker even fire ? Is your HPR wide open ? you must get alot of shootdown.

Out of the box the DM is the smoothest marker I've shot, except for the DROID.
the shootdown isnt as bad as you think i play on legit semi and rarely rip with the gun cause i cant shoot fast on ul frames ( i cant shoot over 13). as in the only way i would notice the shootdown in the summer is if i put it on nxl uncapped. but for semi its so smooth and the efficency isnt horrible. then again im using slik honey with an orange bolt with a lucky board (but the dwell should still be the same amount of ms).


and as for the ebladed cocker tangent, thats because their triggers were made out of metal with a poor magnet design. compare it to wdp and u will see a 100% difference, proper trigger design plus opti = 0 bounce and little to no friction.
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Old 02-21-2008, 05:38 PM #56
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The only way I would play with an angel is if someone gave it to me; then I would play one game, get tired of it, break out my Trauma DM6, and mow faces. I dont want any gun that I have to worry about whether I have a LP tank or not, its easier to screw in any tank to my DM, and as a poor college student, I dont have the cash to blow it on cp adapter for cp reg, especially since I dont like the way they look anyways. And it doesnt take a rocket scientist to lube a bolt.

And to BIG T25, dude, if you're playing back with a 45/45, you're crazier than I am no matter what you shoot. I play front and I dont dare trust anything smaller than a 68.

I am a bit of a gun whore but Dye markers are definitely going to be the biggest part of my arsenal. Nothing has proved itself to be as smooth, accurate, or reliable as a matrix.
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Old 02-21-2008, 05:52 PM #57
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A lot of false stories have been told about DM's.

As long as you take care of their internals, they'll be fine.
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:08 PM #58
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haha i'd take it out of your sig then. and yeah im always going to keep my PM6. ill try new things but i will always know i can go back to it
Yeah the main reason I'm trading is for a DM6. I would like to have a newer marker since the value of mine has gone down in the past few months. I might just end up buying a newer DM and trade the DM5 for a back-up of another make.
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:27 PM #59
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The only way I would play with an angel is if someone gave it to me; then I would play one game, get tired of it, break out my Trauma DM6, and mow faces. I dont want any gun that I have to worry about whether I have a LP tank or not, its easier to screw in any tank to my DM, and as a poor college student, I dont have the cash to blow it on cp adapter for cp reg, especially since I dont like the way they look anyways. And it doesnt take a rocket scientist to lube a bolt.

And to BIG T25, dude, if you're playing back with a 45/45, you're crazier than I am no matter what you shoot. I play front and I dont dare trust anything smaller than a 68.

I am a bit of a gun whore but Dye markers are definitely going to be the biggest part of my arsenal. Nothing has proved itself to be as smooth, accurate, or reliable as a matrix.
angels newer regs work fine on hp or lp and the minireg mod is sinch man.

and alot of back players (or more than i know and can count on 1 hand) use 45/45s to make their setup tighter and they can shoot enough, then again 1 of which use a viking and the rest cept for 1 all shoot bob long guns, (the last shoots a ego 8). its doable just not on a trix. then again i would never use aNYTHING smaller than a 68 for anything but snakeside front
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:51 PM #60
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pms/dms are some of the best markers on the market. all of you baggin on them **Cough** yuik **Cough**, make user errors. If you treat your dm/pm like you should, lube them ever 2000-4000 shots, and dont destroy the gun with settings of a dwell at about 8!. Dwell at like 17-22 depending on weather is perfect. i have a ul'd pm7, and no gun i have ever shot (EXCept the droid) has ever shot as well.
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Old 02-21-2008, 07:43 PM #61
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i've had mine for two years now and i havent had any problems
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Old 02-22-2008, 03:11 AM #62
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To end the arguments I'll just say this, if you want a smooth, incredibly accurate, and reliable marker that gets mediocre efficiency and requires a LITTLE more maintenance then you want a matrix. If you want efficiency, very little maintenance, and dont mind some kick try a poppet valve.

It is true that a matrix does have an insane amount of o-rings that have to be lubed AFTER you play, but it is also true that lubing those o-rings takes a grand total of 2 mins. It's also true that there are a bundle of wires that need to be arranged in the grip frame, but have you opened up a timmy lately? Wires are not as brittle as hoses and thin *** pieces of metal tubing that break off if you bump them. Dms may not be the end all be all of paintball markers and it IS a matter of preference, but DMs are what I prefer and I have shot enough guns to know what I like and I LOVE my Matrix.
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Old 02-24-2008, 03:51 PM #63
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for everyone out here hating on dm's just because of matinence you should really reconsider your argument...if your not willing to spend 10 min. Breaking down your gun checking a few orings and lubing your gun you shouldn't own a 1000$ plus gun...take care of your dm and on the feild it will take care of you I like the way this shoots more then any ego or other gun...what's so bad about cleaning anyway now you know how to maintain. Your gun and solveany more problems if anything breaks or if you encounter problems
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