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Old 11-20-2006, 06:16 AM #1
CrazyLittle (Banned)
 
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Exclamation PMR / Proto Matrix Rail users, WARNING about the solenoid plug!

As a proud new owner of a PMR and general electronics freak I want to give you guys a bit of a warning when working on the board. The solenoid cable's plug on the board-end is a crimped-only connection and it's very fragile!

Be very careful when unplugging the solenoid from the trigger board on your PMR.

If your gun does not fire after you have unplugged/plugged the solenoid into the board, you've probably broken the connection to the plug's leads. Don't worry! If you know a friend with good soldering skills, have them test the conductivity across both wires. If they don't connect (100% resistence) then check the conductivity on each wire individually. Have them solder the wire directly to the plug's lead. Otherwise call Proto and RMA your marker.

Image of the plug in question, click for bigger:



Also, if you're getting a pulse with RF, the rf chip fits perfectly in the top of the trigger frame, upside down with the plug sticking up behind the back of the solenoid. Run the wires down into the frame, and solder them in parallel to the solenoid's wires. That way you don't have to disassemble the whole gun if you pull the board out.

Last edited by CrazyLittle : 11-20-2006 at 03:20 PM. Reason: added a photo
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Old 11-20-2006, 06:47 AM #2
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:24 AM #3
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can we get a how to solder a pulse chip into the PMR ??? it would be appriciated by many .
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Old 11-20-2006, 10:26 AM #4
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Yet more rhetoric on why not to buy a PMR.
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Old 11-20-2006, 11:57 AM #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
Yet more rhetoric on why not to buy a PMR.
Nice way to misinterpret a post, ***.

We're talking about a problem that will only happen if you're modifying the marker in a way that MOST users will not do. Secondly, of those who -DO- modify the solenoid, most will have it professionally done.

Is this a problem? yes. Is this a BIG problem? Hell no. We're talking something that took me 30 minutes of scratching my head, circuit tracing, and then soldering to solve. I figured it was important enough to warn others on the nation to save them the time in troubleshooting. If you want to turn this into a "vs" thread then go troll somewhere else. I hear Gamefaqs is looking for new blood.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmizzle View Post
can we get a how to solder a pulse chip into the PMR ??? it would be appriciated by many .
It's surprisingly simple. Here's how to, off the top of my head:

1) open the grip and disconnect the battery. Also disconnect the eye ribbon cable, the battery/trigger plug and then carefully unplug the solenoid cable.

2) Remove the battery and board. Set them aside.

3) unplug then unscrew the reg. Unscrew the reg ASA. Unscrew the two screws which hold the trigger frame to the marker body. Gently pull the body away from the trigger frame, making sure to grab the trigger return spring and set it aside. Pull the solenoid cable and eye ribbon out of the trigger frame.

4 optional) I find it easier to work on the solenoid when it's detached from the marker body. If you're not comfortable with being able to put it back with its gasket properly aligned then skip this step. Using a #0 phillips screwdriver, unscrew the solenoid from the marker body. Take the solenoid out and grab the solenoid gasket out from behind where the solenoid sat. Remember how it was oriented on the solenoid for when you go to put it back together.

5) Cut both solenoid wires about half-way down. Strip 1-2mm from all four ends. Take some heat-shrink tube and cut two pieces about 1/4" long, and put them on the plug end of the solenoid's wires.

6) Match up the red ends from the solenoid wire's two ends, and the red end from the RF chip's cable. Gently twist them together and solder. Slide the heat shrink tube over the solder joint and shrink in place using a lighter, match or heat gun. Do the same for the black wires. The solenoid cable should run through both ends of the heat shrink tube, with the RF chip cable running back up towards the solenoid.

7) Using a multimeter, test the conductivity from each of the red ends to its mate on the black end. If everything still conducts then you're good to go.

8) Plug the RF chip into the RF chip's cable. It will fit in the back nook of the trigger frame with the plug sticking up behind the solenoid into the marker body. Put the rest of your marker back together

9) Turn the marker on and verify that the solenoid still fires (clicks) without air. Leave the marker on and able to "fire". Turn off your pulse. Hold the power button on the pulse until the light slowly blinks green. Pull the trigger to fire the solenoid. The pulse's LED should blink green quickly. Go ahead and let go of the pulse button. Turn the pulse back on and stop the feed disc with your finger. Verify that the marker is sync'd by pulling the trigger. Each time you pull the disc should start spinning again.

Picture of the finished wires: click for bigger:


Picture of the rf chip seated, ready to re-assemble. Click for bigger:

Last edited by CrazyLittle : 11-20-2006 at 03:22 PM. Reason: added photos
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Old 11-20-2006, 12:31 PM #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyLittle View Post
Nice way to misinterpret a post, ***.

We're talking about a problem that will only happen if you're modifying the marker in a way that MOST users will not do. Secondly, of those who -DO- modify the solenoid, most will have it professionally done.
How am I an *** for having an opinion?

And as for "modifying"... How the **** is taking your gun apart modifying??
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Old 11-20-2006, 12:38 PM #7
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Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
How am I an *** for having an opinion?
You're an *** for making the ASSumption that a -common- electronics problem is indicitive of some flaw in one marker, when the same problem probably applies to all products with solenoids manufactured by the same supplier. It's not a problem with the PMR, dye or the marker's design. It's a problem with the plug. You're an *** because of your sig. Look in the mirror.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
And as for "modifying"... How the **** is taking your gun apart modifying??
If you're not messing with the solenoid there's very little reason to take that portion of the marker apart. If you -are- messing with the solenoid or trigger board (in order to solder on a pulse RF chip) then you're "modifying" the marker, and you're probably voiding the 1-yr warranty too.
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Old 11-20-2006, 12:58 PM #8
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Thanks,
This is gunna save me a big headache.
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:26 PM #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyLittle View Post
If you're not messing with the solenoid there's very little reason to take that portion of the marker apart. If you -are- messing with the solenoid or trigger board (in order to solder on a pulse RF chip) then you're "modifying" the marker, and you're probably voiding the 1-yr warranty too.
Well, except for the fact that removing the solenoid is voiding the marker and you sometimes need to do that to clean it.
And don't call me an ***. My sig is very true. Look at the overwhelming majority of the demograph that buys PMR's and then come back to me.

And what the hell is ASSumption? What are you, three? Stop avoiding the swear filter.
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:27 PM #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
Yet more rhetoric on why not to buy a PMR.
retard.
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:30 PM #11
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retard.
Right. That's nice.
Way to use english for what it was meant to be used for.
Calling people retarted from over the internet.
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:41 PM #12
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Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
Well, except for the fact that removing the solenoid is voiding the marker and you sometimes need to do that to clean it.
No, removing the solenoid for maintenance is mentioned in the manual. Putting it back the way you found it isn't going to void the warranty. Modifying the solenoid, wire harness or board will.

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Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
My sig is very true. Look at the overwhelming majority of the demograph that buys PMR's and then come back to me.
What demograph? You're talking about a marker that's been out less than 5 days. There's a target market, but no demograph yet. Your sig and your posts are the only ignorant "rhetoric" in this thread. Go away.

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And what the hell is ASSumption? What are you, three? Stop avoiding the swear filter.
If you don't know what "assumption" means go dump it into www.m-w.com
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:45 PM #13
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Originally Posted by CrazyLittle View Post
If you don't know what "assumption" means go dump it into www.m-w.com

No, you idiot. I know what an assumption is.
I meant, what the hell is with you capitolizing on the capitalization of the first three letter's to try to get your point across, it's pedantic and kinda immature.

Now, onto your thoughts about the solenoid. Removing it will completely void your warrenty. Trust me, man. I've been around trixes long enough to know Dye and their policies. If you pull out those screws you're boned.
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:52 PM #14
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Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
Now, onto your thoughts about the solenoid. Removing it will completely void your warrenty. Trust me, man. I've been around trixes long enough to know Dye and their policies. If you pull out those screws you're boned.
Do you even own a dye marker? Have you read the manual?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TROUBLE SHOOTING GUIDE
AIR LEAKING BETWEEN BODY AND FRAME
  • If the above doesn't help remove the frame from the PMR and remove the solenoid by unscrewing the two screws mounting it down. Apply some lube to the seat underneath the solenoid and re-assemble making sure that the solenoid is well tightened into the body and that the eye wire is not pinched underneath the solenoid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MATRIX WARRANTY INFORMATION
...The solenoid and electronic components on the marker are warranted for six months. This warranty does not cover scratches, nicks, improper disassembly, improper re-assembly, misuse, neglect or improper storage. Modification to the product will void the warranty.
So will you go away now?
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:55 PM #15
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Originally Posted by CrazyLittle View Post
Do you even own a dye marker? Have you read the manual?
Yes. And it's not a Rail. I apologize for my assumptions towards the noid warrenty. It's been Dye's policy in the past that if you remove the Solenoid you will void the warrenty. But I suppose that's only on the DM and PM lines.
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:56 PM #16
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Yes. And it's not a Rail.
Then will you kindly gtfo?
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Old 11-20-2006, 01:57 PM #17
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Then will you kindly gtfo?
Loving the over emphasized sense of accomplishment on your part.
Auevoir.
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Old 11-20-2006, 02:13 PM #18
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Wow...that was INTENSE! lol. Thanks for that information. It also does apply to if you buy an aftermarket board, am I correct? Or would you just buy a new harness to solve that problem?
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Old 11-20-2006, 02:39 PM #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disturbedperson View Post
Yes. And it's not a Rail. I apologize for my assumptions towards the noid warrenty. It's been Dye's policy in the past that if you remove the Solenoid you will void the warrenty. But I suppose that's only on the DM and PM lines.
NO. If you take apart the solenoid, then your warranty is void. Not if you remove it from the marker.
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Old 11-20-2006, 02:45 PM #20
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Thanks for the heads up CrazyLittle. I'm sure it will help a lot of people avoid trouble in the future.
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Old 11-20-2006, 02:46 PM #21
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Originally Posted by blueice547 View Post
Wow...that was INTENSE! lol. Thanks for that information. It also does apply to if you buy an aftermarket board, am I correct? Or would you just buy a new harness to solve that problem?
To my knowledge there's no aftermarket board -available- yet, but when they come they should be using the same plug socket as the original board. My suggestion is to reinforce the wires inside the plug with solder.
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