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Old 06-06-2006, 12:28 AM #1
AzraelsBurden
 
 
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First run

Well after my intial set back with a blown noid I finally was able to take my new Wrath to game on Sunday. Man was I impressed. My main gun was a cocker and I love the thing (built it from the ground up) but the Wrath preformed so well. I loved the smoothness and the weight felt really balanced. It shot straight and as quick as I asked. I chopped 1 ball out of a case of paint and that was mainly my fault and half of my two set backs for the day.

Like I said it was my first run with the gun and although I fired about 1000 rounds in my garage without ever having a problem, I guess shooting on the move shimmied the push pin up and the bolt shot out the back of the gun, and thanks to my egg so did about 15 balls. At first I was baffled by it then after reinserting it it finally came to me I had never tightened the retainer bolt for the push pin. No problems after that. (the chopped ball was sometime just prior to the bolt shooting out)

The only other thing that had me puzzled was the extreme sensativity of the LPR. The field was set at 260 and I got it to the 250's on the pre chrono and it did fine the first two games ranging from 245 to 258 but after that droped down to low 200's and when I ever so slightly adjustedthe LPR it blazed near 300, and I mean ever so slightly. I could not for the life of me get it to settle for mid 250's. it was either 200's or just under 300. My HPR is set at the recomended pressure (cant remember exactey what right now). I have a delrin bolt nad ram, should I change the HPR setting? and will changing that make the LPR less sensative? any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
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Old 06-06-2006, 12:42 AM #2
jayrad
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What do you have it running at?
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Old 06-06-2006, 06:11 AM #3
The Inflicted
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The manual reccomends an input pressure of 200, but 250psi works much better. The Wrath uses far less gas that way and is easier on paint, though it's actually a bit harder to set the LPR when the input is higher...

Sometimes you just have to juggle the two regulators until you have the proper velocity. If you're having problems, don't worry so much about where the HPR is as long as the gauge is reading somewhere between 200 and 260.

Last edited by The Inflicted : 06-06-2006 at 06:21 AM.
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Old 06-06-2006, 01:54 PM #4
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What is the difference between adjusting the LPR or the HPR? I have just kept my LPR at the same stock setting and just adjust the HPR to how fast the field limit is. You say the HPR should be 200-260, mine is only at about 170 and gets 260 fps..? Does this mean anything, and should I adjust my LPR at all?
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Old 06-06-2006, 02:09 PM #5
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it means your getting really bad effeciancy
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Old 06-06-2006, 02:22 PM #6
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Ok...lol thats actually good news...I was worried when I drained my whole tank in like 250 shots lol. Now i should be able to fix that. Well earlier on I adjusted my hpr to high and my LP hose exploded, but I forgot how high it was, so...would it be safe to adjust the HPR to 250?
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Old 06-06-2006, 04:47 PM #7
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Set the HPR at 250-260 psi and leave it alone. Use the LPR ONLY to make velocity adjustments.

I noticed you said you have a delrin ram, so your HPR may need to be closer to 275.

You will get wild fps fluctuations if you use the HPR to adjust velocity.
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Old 06-06-2006, 05:16 PM #8
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Where do u change the HP and LP? Im pretty sure the HP is the vertical regulator coming down with the gauge on it right? I dont see where u change the LP though...unless I mixed them up or something...
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Old 06-06-2006, 06:18 PM #9
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See if this clears anything up. I wrote this a couple days ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Inflicted
Let me break it down for you:

Inside a nitrogen/HPA tank will be very high pressures- 3,000 psi in a cheap tank, 4,500 or even 5,000 in the newer ones. CO2 tanks are self-regulating, so once the pressure reaches 800 or so the gas condenses and stays at the same pressure.

There's a regulator on the end of every HPA tank that reduces the output pressure down to something a paintball gun can use, since full bottle pressure would probably blow out your bottomline hose. Most HPA tanks have an output pressure of about 850psi. There are also special "low pressure" tanks that put out 450psi or so, and many of the more expensive tanks are adjustable. The output pressure of CO2 will usually be right at 800psi because again, the properties of the gas make it self-regulating.

The Wrath, like most other electronic paintball guns, has an inline or input regulator screwed into the vertical adapter, acting as a foregrip. This regulator takes the pressure coming in from the tank, and whether it was at 800 or 400 psi, reduces it down to the operating pressure of the gun. In the Wrath's case, that pressure is around 250psi.

The Wrath has another regulator, the LPR, that reduces some of that gas to an even lower pressure so that it can be used by some of the gun's more fragile parts. It's not known exactly what pressure the Wrath's LPR usually runs at but I imagine it's just over 100psi.
Edit: jjdstr340 has pointed out that "Mark" from NPS' tech department has stated that the Wrath's LPR pressure is considerably higher, up to 150psi. This makes sense when you think about the Odyssey RPM, a Wrath-derrived design that has no LPR at all and feeds its solenoid and valve at the same pressure.


Last edited by The Inflicted : 08-14-2006 at 10:51 AM.
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Old 06-06-2006, 06:56 PM #10
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so do u have to change the lpr at all? is it even adjustable? and how are u suppose to know how much psi is being used?
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Old 06-06-2006, 07:18 PM #11
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Yes, you adjust it from the front via an allen wrench, same way you adjust the input regulator. You don't need a gauge because the procedure goes like this:

1. Set input regulator to 250psi
2. Chrono gun.
3. If velocity is too high, screw the LPR adjustment screw OUT (counterclockwise) and repeat step 2.
4. If velocity is too low, screw the LPR adjustment screw IN (clockwise) and repeat step 2.

When in doubt, you can start with the LPR adjustment screw backed most of the way OUT, and slowly screw it in (increasing LPR pressure) to bring your velocity up to the desired level.
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Old 06-06-2006, 07:23 PM #12
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ahhhh i c sed the blind man
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Old 06-06-2006, 07:24 PM #13
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there is no way to do it w/out a guage huh?
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Old 06-06-2006, 07:49 PM #14
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I guess you could. As long as the gun is functioning and shooting under 300fps it really doesn't matter.

However, without a gauge you run a greater risk of accidently setting your LPR way too high and blowing out a pneumatic hose, and it will be very difficult to tune your Wrath for maximum efficiency.
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Old 06-06-2006, 08:49 PM #15
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thanks Inflicted, nicely put
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Old 06-07-2006, 08:32 AM #16
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Maybe it's the cocker owner in me but wouldn't having a lighter ram and bolt enable you to lower your pressure not raise it? Less weight means less air required to push it right?
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Old 06-07-2006, 09:04 AM #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzraelsBurden
Maybe it's the cocker owner in me but wouldn't having a lighter ram and bolt enable you to lower your pressure not raise it? Less weight means less air required to push it right?
I see what you're driving at, but remember that in a cocker the parts that open the valve are separated from the parts that recock the gun. In the Wrath, they are one in the same. When the gun is actually firing, the closest part to a Wrath's ram is a cocker's hammer, not the bolt or ram. Most people who are building super low-pressure cockers go out of their way to find the heaviest hammers available (even going so far as to use tungsten in some of the really expensive parts Freeflow used to make) because you want that big moving mass to do a lot of the work for you so you can save gas in the pneumatics and use a lighter springset and valve pressure.

This is why when Wrath users switch to lighter weight delrin rams they have to drastically increase their input and LP pressures to compensate for the intial loss in velocity.
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Old 06-07-2006, 12:23 PM #18
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Thanks Inflicted, took a couple of times for it to sink in but more makes sense to me now. I'm off to up my HPR and to find me a chrono.
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Old 06-07-2006, 01:05 PM #19
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I know it's not needed, but I was wondering, how do people figure out the psi their LPR is set at? I've seen a few, in the t-board settings thread, talk about how their LPR is set to 100psi or around there. I just like to know everything that's going on.
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Old 06-07-2006, 07:09 PM #20
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You would need something like a Matrix or Angel LPR tester to actually know what pressure the LPR is putting out. 110 psi is just a guess, really, based on the operating pressures of things like Intimidators and Bushmasters, and assuming that it's a wee bit more since there's a valve to open.

That and the operating/burst pressure of the LP hose the gun uses.
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Old 06-07-2006, 07:18 PM #21
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Mark has stated that the LPR runs around 140-150 psi.
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