You guys want some Diadem news?

[RamDragon]

New News about the AM Diadem ITS:

The Diadem ITS boasts many of the same high performance traits of its high dollar competitors, at a much more reasonable price. High rate of fire, seven selectable modes of fire, user programmable settings, dual regulators, low drain circuitry for long battery life, and all of this in one of the smallest and lightest packages yet in the Electro-Pneumatic family. But before, you would have had to buy a whole new marker, because it couldn’t be retrofit into the Sentinel.

That has changed. You wore us down. The last delay on the Diadem ITS is almost over, and it is time to announce that we have decided to make a retrofit kit as well. You can soon replace your hammer with a pneumatic ram and replace the lower receiver with the Diadem Lower receiver (it is that simple) and turn your Sentinel into a Diadem. The entire conversion takes less than five minutes.

http://www.actionmarkers.com/images/diadem.jpg

The Diadem will also still be available as a full package. So if you don’t own a Sentinel you will still be able to get the Diadem.

Look for this upgrade to hit the market soon. It will be announced on our website first, but we will put a post here as well to give PBN a heads up! They will sell fast!

[jawpaul]

Sweet! Man now I feel bad about buying my used B2k. If only I had have waited.

[DaHick]

awesome


just, awesome

[Crazy_Chiken]

thanks for the news

please tell me that the picture is a converted Sentinal and not the full Diadem

[Draknes]

What can I say?
I called it!!! :P

[DaHick]

Yes you did.




Now go back to the abyss prepaired for you!

[Draknes]

Now if only we had a price.....

[Pstan]

DaHick = :cool:



Pstan = :(

[DaHick]

LOL.... no kidding pstan... bad timming on your part.

[ccrnnr9]

any idea on asking price for the diamdem and the conversion kit for the sentinel as well?

[Barto]

Up next: retrofit your Illusion into a Diadem

;)

[Gilman]

Is that a low pressure chamber on that retro fitted sentinel? I'll take one of those instead.

[Alexi1337]

God that is sexy...

[mccockerboy]

What bps is this Kit rated at?

[mccockerboy]

on the front its the normal front cap just sliver, and a Palmer micro rock(or looks like it)

[DaHick]

thats not a typical sentinal VA.

[Crash STP]

I used the sentinel conversion at the West Point big gamer last saturday so look for some spy shots from there in the big 3 magazines and sites....

it is faster than the Diadem ITS
:evilgrin:

24v warp feed on order.........

9 pods and a halo B on 3500 psi in a 88/5k tank

[ccrnnr9]

Can anybody give me and estimate on conversion kit price? I would assume its gonna be upwards of 300$. If anybody could help, that would be great!

[AM-Steve]

The kit as shown will be Approx $400. It will replace the lower receier, come with two regulators, a new ASA, a new volume chamber, the air Cylinder, a new Drop Forward, and of course all of the electronics. We will have a firm price in about a week.

We are also working on different levels of the kit for people that have their own regs etc. Our goal is to have at least one version of the conversion kit that will be $100 or so. At this point it is just a matter of testing different configurations and seeing what will work.

Look for more news on this to be on the website and here at PB Nation.

Also, the reason the conversion is faster than the normal Diadem that Crash was using is that we have made a few improvements on the air flow through the Ram since the IAO. This improved Ram will be shipping on the standard Diadem as well, so that both will be able to obtain the same ROF.

[ccrnnr9]

Oooo...I like the idea of having different kits of different costs. I knwo my sentinel will have its own reg already, so I may not need another. Whats the est. ROF on this puppy? Thanks AM!
~Nick

[AM-Steve]

Currently 19 BPS is about what I would recomend as the highest -- with some user teweaking -- should be able to clear 20+.

And now for my soapbox sermon:

Honestly though -- and this is something I always maintain 12-15 should be enough. I normally shoot set at 11. I haven't seen my game suffer at all. For fun I will bump it up to 16-17 to show it off. But I haven't found a need to shoot that fast in a game. Even though it is fun -- just empties the hopper too fast.

[Gilman]

How about prices on different parts. I would like the volume chamber.

[ccrnnr9]

Originally posted by AM-Steve
Honestly though -- and this is something I always maintain 12-15 should be enough. I normally shoot set at 11. I haven't seen my game suffer at all. For fun I will bump it up to 16-17 to show it off. But I haven't found a need to shoot that fast in a game. Even though it is fun -- just empties the hopper too fast. I totally agree with yu there. I was just wondering out of curiosity. I usually play stock class, so that pretty much should give you an idea of about how much paint I shoot per game. Anyways, looks like it is gonna be a great gun! I can decide if I wanna buy a sentinel or an illusion now!:P

[AM-Steve]

All of the upgrade parts will be priced individually for people to be able to pick and choose what they want.

[Draknes]

If you can get a conversion kit for $100 out, that will put the senti on a whole different level in terms of blowbacks. Instead of spending $100 on a cheapo plastic e-grip, you can convert it to a full electropneumatic monster :devil:

Can't wait :evilgrin:

[ccrnnr9]

Originally posted by Draknes
Can't wait :evilgrin: I think he speaks for all of us!;)
~Nick

[jawpaul]

Great now I am so sad that I bought a B2k.
I should have just bought a Sentinel TS since I had falled in love with them since I first saw one.
Now this almost makes me sick it is so good.
Because that is why I bought a B2k so I would have a true electro and not have to worry about out growing it for a while.

[ccrnnr9]

Well, I may just have to buy a sentinel now! I cant wait till this kit is ready! Right now I just have to deicide if I want an illusion or sentinel...if you guys were to make a retrofit kit for the illusion, I would be all over it:P !...Either way, AM gets my business!

[FuzzyChicken]

AM you guys ROCK!! w00t w00t!

[il Padrino]

Ahh! If only the rest of the world knew of the glory that pours forth from Action Markers!
Soon they shall, my children! Soon they shall!

[The Yellow Dart]

How about a video AM

[Jack & Coke]

Yeah! I agree!

I'd love to see a 19-20+ bps video of the Diadem!!!!

Great job guys!

[FuzzyChicken]

Any new news on the conversion kit? Any confimed prices and exact parts included in the various kits?

[FuzzyChicken]

When roughly will the conversion kit(s) be ready for purchase. What exactly will the kits contain? Any new information or word on these?

[RamDragon]

I don't have word yet on exact prices and what the kits will include, but I will post it here as soon as I hear anything. Right now, I know we are planning a full kit with all the Diadem functions and versatility at around $400 (that's not an exact price but we will try to stay close) and a single function, solid-state circuit lower receiver with ram for around $100 (and that one is not yet set in stone either.) We are planning to have kits with one and two regs, just the ram, just the receiver, with our new barrel system and without, and in several other configurations. We just haven’t decided which ones yet.

Keep in mind that often we post things here as the decision is made. I like to write these up as soon as we leave the meetings. More often than not, we post things here before we even post it on our own web site! We like you guys that much.

I'll let you all in on a little secret, though. We are experimenting with in-house anodizing, which when we get that going will cut our turnaround time in half between the time we make a decision and the time it goes to market. Hang in there; we're just in a pregnant pause right now. Parts are at the anodizer; things are shipping right now to and from. We expect another two weeks to account for shipping times and assembly.

Fret not, dear friends! Diadems are imminent!

[FuzzyChicken]

thanx a lot for the lil update and given us a little time period of about 2 weeks or so... I was just excited and felt like bugging u guys ;)

[RamDragon]

Well, it worked. I hope you're proud of yourself, 'cause now we're bugged:mad: GRRR!

[FuzzyChicken]

Originally posted by RamDragon
Well, it worked. I hope you're proud of yourself, 'cause now we're bugged:mad: GRRR!

I dont want to bugg AM! u guys rock!:cool: Keep up the good work! Sorry for bugging u guys.... I will leave you to your work so that you can come out with the kits sooner.

[AM-Steve]

Hey everybody -- I know that you have all been wanting to see some video of the Diadem -- so yesterday we geared up and shot some videos of the Diadem shooting from 3 - 20 BPS!! Look for these to be posted online soon. -- These are going to be larger files so look for them to be on www.actionmarkers.com instead of here at the Nation.

[FuzzyChicken]

i cant wait Steve! Just keep working so you guys can get the kit(s) out ASAP! :P

[Crazy_Chiken]

good movies Steve thanks and keep up the good work

[RamDragon]

Finally! We have the long awaited and greatly coveted video footage of the Diadem in action! Take a look at our videos! It’s a very large file; so you might only be able do download it on broadband.

Link Here for our Video Gallery (http://www.actionmarkers.com/Video/videofiles.htm)

And if you still want to see something, we also had a heavy-load delivery truck of ours run a Sentinel over. The barrel was re-measured with a micrometer after this test and was turned around when it was put back on, but that is the same barrel on at the end even though you can’t see the scratches. This is the same gun we did the famous Jeep Test on.

Special thanks to AM-Laura for helping out on this video!

[Hobboy]

YES!!!

That video ****ing ruled. Thanks. :tup:

[FuzzyChicken]

I only got to watch the first two and they were sweet... whenever I try and click the last one 'Long Diadem' my internet seems to not work, something wrong with AM's site?! Anyways, the videos really brought the Diadem to life, whoa!

[teddyboy]

whats the trigger pull like on this new dealy'o; is it ajustible? and what is that suff up front, it looks like a front block
if I do spend 400 on this set up will it really put me ahead with cockers and impies and other high end guns?

[bushwhakersplinter]

i jsut shot the diadem conversion and without trying i was outshooting my reloader and it is the smallest and lightest electro pneumatic marker

[AM-Steve]

Originally posted by teddyboy
whats the trigger pull like on this new dealy'o; is it ajustible? and what is that suff up front, it looks like a front block
if I do spend 400 on this set up will it really put me ahead with cockers and impies and other high end guns?

Trigger pull is adjustable to under .5mm and the front set up is the Volume Chamber as well as a Low Pressure Regulator to move the Ram.

The Diadem can easily shoot as fast and generally more accurately than any cocker, impulse, or other marker. I have heard (but not seen yet-- we will run this test ourselves sometime) of Crash outshooting the Angel Speed. Ask him about the west point experience.

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by AM-Steve


...and generally more accurately than any cocker, impulse, or other marker...



Sheesh...

I thought you guys were above such low level rhetoric... :rolleyes:

I'm quite disappointed you have stooped to the tactics of over-hyping your own product at the expense of a competitor's product.

What controlled scientific tests have you run to come to such conclusions?

Do you have recorded test data to prove such statements?

We want Diadem news, not the same old over-hyped BS that other companies shovel out.

[DCB]

I would love to see Crash rippin!
Is the reg up front a Palmer?
The reason I like AM over the rest is they make all their own parts so you know it is done right and will work. Not that the other makers don't do some of this, but AM also has great prices and stands behind they products 100%! They lesten to the users and act on it.

[bushwhakersplinter]

for example the senti diadem conversion

[DCB]

Perfect example!!! Not many companies would do something like that...they would say just buy our new marker if you want the new stuff. Another one is the new barrel kit....the only other maker I know of who did this is WGP and I am told it is a great system. I can't wait to see how AM's kit does....if it does well I will get one! I can use it on my Sniper and the inserts in my custom Phantom barrel.

[AM-Steve]

Originally posted by Jack & Coke
Sheesh...

I thought you guys were above such low level rhetoric... :rolleyes:

I'm quite disappointed you have stooped to the tactics of over-hyping your own product at the expense of a competitor's product.

What controlled scientific tests have you run to come to such conclusions?

Do you have recorded test data to prove such statements?

We want Diadem news, not the same old over-hyped BS that other companies shovel out.

I only mentioned the others to address a specific question -- In my opinion the Diadem should outperform those mentioned. The reason being that we do actually test our markers side by side with every marker in the same price range. If we are not offering a marker that we feel is actually better then the competitions then we will not release it. We are not in the business of making just another option, if we don't make a better gun for the price, then there is no point in making the product at all.

To simply answer your question, yes we do have recorded scientific tests that prove our statements, but no we don't publish them because we do not feel that our tests would be believed as unbiased -- we perform the test to make sure that we are not over-hyping our markers, and invite anyone to make their own tests to see how things go for them.

Feel free to disregard anything that you feel is rhetoric.

[r3zjimbo]

Just sold my angel to buy one....hope it's great

[Jack & Coke]

Steve,

Ah... so you do have "test results"... interesting...

Please explain to us how you tested the Diadem and other guns for "accuracy"...

Please do post your test results. Don't worry about us if we think you're biased. We'll keep an open mind!;)

Just think how much positive buzz you would generate for AM fans if you could PROVE you gun IS GENEREALLY MORE ACCURATE than any cocker, impulse, or other marker.

Also, please explain what you think "accuracy" is and how it relates to "consistancy"...

p.s. You know from ALL of my previous posts than I've been a positive supporter of AM. But that doesn't make me a blind lemming. If I see BS claims posted by manufacturers, I 'll call it like I see it... BS until PROVEN OTHERWISE.

...now let's see this "proof".

[Draknes]

Although it sounds like BS, I'll vouch for them. I did a fairly controlled test with my friend's STO (pretty much no stock internals) vs my Senti (new valve pin + performance sear). We used the same exact barrel (14" Dye Boomstick), high pressure regulator (ANS GenX), compressed air tank (88/3k Nitro Duck), and shot paint from the same case (RPS Marb). Overall the sentinel was much more consistant (and therefore accurate) and during the best trial (we did 10 for each) its consistancy was +/- 2fps, the worst was +/- 5. For the STO the best trial was +/- 5 and the worst +/- 8. I admit that our tests weren't perfect but they were as controlled as we could possibly get them and it was clear that under the given conditions the Sentinel was more consistant. I don't know why the results came out the way they did but I think it is probably due to the fact that AM's tolerances are higher than WGP's (and maybe because the velocity is adjusted through the valve spring?).

[AM-Steve]

Velocity Testing Procedures

1.) set up all markers in the same configuration as closely as possible – allowing that not all markers will have the same options for setting them up
2.) set the gun into a vice to hold it steady
3.) put the marker set up into a climate controlled area
4.) set a target up at a specified distance – normally we will test 25, 50, 75, 100, and 150 feet
5.) shoot a quantity of paint at the target from the vice – normally we will test 10, 25, 50, and 100 rounds
6.) measure the “spread” of the paint
a. spread is defined by us as the distance of height, width and two diagonals on the target.
7.) Record your findings


• Repeat the test 3 times for every distance, paint quantity combination there is.
• If there are any glaring discrepancies, repeat the test to normalize
• Repeat for different BPS rates
• Repeat the test for different paints
• Repeat for different barrel systems


We also then test for velocity consistency, ROF, and air consumption.

Now honestly, the Diadem did not come out on top of every single test as the best. But, again honestly, it came out on top of well more than half the tests and so I would feel completely confident in saying that the Diadem will “generally” be more accurate than “most” of the guns out there.

As to publishing it, we still are not going to. I know that you would love to see the data, and I know that people are going to think that this is BS, and I can not stop that and don’t intend to try. There are many reasons that we keep internal tests as internal tests. The information was used in developing and marketing the Diadem, and as such we consider it proprietary information. That doesn’t stop anyone from trying the tests out themselves though. We encourage that, because we are 100% confident in our products. Do the tests as Draknes did, and I am sure that you will get the same results – we have heard it hundreds of times (well at least dozens -- I haven't kept an accurate count :D)

[DCB]

What he said!

[ingenexec]

Well, as much as i'd love to join the bunch of whining about all this testing controversy, how bout a real question. How do you adjust the pressure on the diadem? It looks like the LP chamber got rid of the allen screw, so how's this work? I'm confuzzled. Help me!

[Jack & Coke]

Thanks for the relpy Steve,

What do you believe are the primary contributing factors to the concept of "accuracy" as far as paintball ballistics are concerned?

The Gun?

The Ball?

The Barrel?

The Barrel-to-Ball match?

Remember, the question is about "accuracy" not "consistancy", they are two seperate beasts.

[DCB]

Without the "consistency" there will be no "accuracy".

[Jack & Coke]

Not true...

You are confusing the two terms.

[DCB]

If your consistency is off (280....250...290...) then you will not have a very accurate marker. It is not the only variable in the equation, but it is a very important one. Paint to barrel is the other main variable. If you have both then you will, if you do your part, hit what you aim at!

[ingenexec]

far as i'm concerned jack, yes true :P. Paintballs are inherently inaccurate (they spin, they'll miss. They catch any wind, they'll miss. Any air behind em in the barrel, they'll miss...you see where this is going.) Accuracy is all about paint to barrel match. Warpig showed that a damn spyder is as accurate as a cocker! Open bolt and closed bolt dont matter, its all paint to bore, and the barrel you're using. I cant hit **** with my friends cocker, and they're supposed to be o so accurate :P Call me a bad shot if u want, but bench tests prove: the gun is not the point of accuracy. other than that, most people see accuracy as being able to hit the same point over and over. Thats consistant. Thus, thats a consistancy issue, not accuracy. Accuracy (as i've said, and cant demonstrate) is pretty much relient on the user.

[Jack & Coke]

ingenexec has caught the correct!

[ingenexec]

sorry to be redundant after DCB, but i was typing my reply as he sent his, so i didnt know bout it till it was too late.

[DCB]

When I shot my handgun in a compition I want it to be as accurate as possible. I have had it worked on (1911 style) so that every time I pull the trigger and the slide cycles it will lock up in the same place every time (that is consistency); now I load my own ammo and use the best parts I can find so I can hit what I need to. If one of those things are off then it will not be as accurate as it could be. I know that the shooter has a whole lot to do with it, but if you put it in a vice and shoot at a target then you take out the shooter from the equasion and then you can compair handgun with handgun and see which is the most accurate. I know bullets and paintballs are not even close to each other, but the point is the same. AM said they took out the shooter from the equation to see how there marker compares with others...same everything except the marker and it did very well indeed. That is all AM is saying...given all the variables are the same the AM is better than most. Shooting a paintball can be very aggravating activity! Paint is very inconsistent so it helps if all the other parts are working together.

[Jack & Coke]

Due to the poor flight dynamics of a liquid filled gelatin capsule, any hard conclusions regarding "accuracy" that you can come up with from any type of bench testing are negligible. This has been proven many times at AGD. (http://www.automags.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=6)

The ammo being fired is too unpredictable to compare guns. Ball-to-ball weight, dimensions, and paint viscosities vary too much. If you want to do it right, you'll need solid, heavy balls.

"Accuracy" relates to hitting what you're aiming at.

"consistancy" has two meanings in paintball:

1. shot-to-shot muzzle velocity consistancy.
2. expecting each ball to land right on top of each other... this way you can "walk" your stream of shots into your target.

The later of the two is more influenced by the shooter and how steady he can hold his gun on target. A low kicking gun like a Matrix, helps a lot in this category.

The "consistancy" of the gun's in-line regs also play too much of a role in this equation.

The most important factors in paintball "accuracy" are the quality of paintballs, the quality of the barrel, and how well they match.

The reality is that the gun has very little to do with "accuracy".

The gun has more of a role in the "consistancy" department. The main contributors to the "consistancy" are the ball-to-barrel match, the gun's mechanics (e.g. main valve, springs, reciprocating mass, kick, etc.), the main in-line reg, and the tank reg.

To think otherwise is just naive or unscrupulously misleading...

You want "accuracy"? Get better balls, a better barrel, and make sure they match.

[cryogenic76]

I think the trigger can also effect the accuracy. I've found that with guns (like a Spyder) that have very long or heavy trigger pulls, it's harder to keep the gun on target. A lighter trigger pul leads to steadier aiming. Recoil can also be a factor. That's all. Just though I'd share that.

[DCB]

I agree...the paint and barrel is the single most important factor for accuracy. AM used the same paint and barrel for the test and it did better than most.

A good trigger is also very important when the shooter is involved.

I am done.

[cryogenic76]

Accuracy this, barrel and paint that..... I'll still send you to the dead box.

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by DCB


AM used the same paint and barrel for the test and it did better than most.



They did?:dodgy:

Which paint and which barrel did they use?

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by cryogenic76
Accuracy this, barrel and paint that..... I'll still send you to the dead box.

http://www.automags.org/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=486329

:rolleyes:

[cryogenic76]

I am cool, aren't I? (thanks for the pic)

Whatever. Paintball is played on the field, not at the testing range or in the paint/barrel match.

[Jack & Coke]

Such venerable intelligence...

[r3zjimbo]

Are you that stupid that you will sit here and say that these test are completely irrelevant to paintball? How bout we take my angel and freak out and u can use a wooden barrel or something and we will see how well you send me to the dead box. If people dont sit down and share ideas and processes about paintball, equipment doesnt get made.

As far as your not caring about paint barrel match, go have a machine shot my u a .80 mm barrel, see how you like your guns accuracy.

[cryogenic76]

I didn't say they were irrelevent. You took your example to ridiculous extremes. I wouldn't use a wooden barrel, I'd probably get splinters anyway. I use a Dye Boomstick, and I use it with whatever paint the field happens to be selling, and 99.9% of the time it works like a charm.

The next time I see a .80 cal. wooden barrel I'll take back everything I've said here.

[AM-Steve]

Jack -- you are correct in the difference between accuracy and consistency. However, we do feel (and take this how you will) that there the marker itself does affect the accuracy of the marker.

Factors affecting the accuracy -- according to our tests (not in any particualr order) -- all of these and more affect the actual "accuracy" of the shot -- how close it hits to where it is pointed.

1: Paint to barrel match
2: types and placement of porting
3: Length and paint match to unported start of barrel
4: overall length of barrel (the longer the better, up to a point and then it can adversely affect accuracy by increasing drag and spin on the ball)
5: type of bolt and how it hits the ball
6: ball detent design and number -- 2 ball detents does actually center the ball and decrease the chance of spin being picked up -- different types of ball detents affect the ball differently as well
7: weather and other factors
8: Velocity of the shot

and there are more of course -- some days it seems like the reletive position of Jupiter affects things for all we can tell. And that's why we do the tests multiple times.

I would go as far to say though that in the case of paintball the accuracy can be affected by the consistency of the valve -- if not directly the consistency of the velocity. And there are others that I am not thinking of off the top of my head.

One last thing though -- let's all try to stay on the friendly side here. There is no reason to get hostile about it.

[cryogenic76]

I am going to make a wooden barrel now. It won't shoot well, but how would a wooden barrel not be cool?

(ps-I wasn't trying to be hostile, you guys just reacted like I was bashing all of paintball)

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by AM-Steve
Jack -- you are correct in the difference between accuracy and consistency. However, we do feel (and take this how you will) that there the marker itself does affect the accuracy of the marker.

Factors affecting the accuracy -- according to our tests (not in any particualr order) -- all of these and more affect the actual "accuracy" of the shot -- how close it hits to where it is pointed.

1: Paint to barrel match
2: types and placement of porting
3: Length and paint match to unported start of barrel
4: overall length of barrel (the longer the better, up to a point and then it can adversely affect accuracy by increasing drag and spin on the ball)
5: type of bolt and how it hits the ball
6: ball detent design and number -- 2 ball detents does actually center the ball and decrease the chance of spin being picked up -- different types of ball detents affect the ball differently as well
7: weather and other factors
8: Velocity of the shot



Only 2 items (5 & 6) have anything phyically to do with the gun.

The rest of hte items above are negligible because they will be the same for all comparisons (standardize testing correct?)

Q1: How many different style bolts and detent configurations have you used in these "tests" you've conducted?

Q2: Is the bolt you're using on the Diadem hollow (1 big hole down the middle) or venturi style?

Q3: Also, do you actually believe the bolt "hits" the ball when you pull the trigger?



Originally posted by AM-Steve


One last thing though -- let's all try to stay on the friendly side here. There is no reason to get hostile about it.



I agree... thanks for keeping it civil.:tup:

Also, please don't take my questions as attacks.

I don't believe any of the questions I've asked so far are unfair... at least not for a reputable, and respectable company such as AM.

[Draknes]

:O
now this is all starting to sound like SP hype....

[ingenexec]

Jack, i hate to be so blunt, but just accept that the tests were done right and arent biased? Or at least email AM about it. We dont need to see all this junk on the board, clogging it up. Besides, we do need info on the diadem itself. I'm waiting on price tag and availability, if you dont mind...

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by ingenexec
Jack, i hate to be so blunt, but just accept that the tests were done right and arent biased? Or at least email AM about it. We dont need to see all this junk on the board, clogging it up. Besides, we do need info on the diadem itself. I'm waiting on price tag and availability, if you dont mind...

ingenexec, I'm sorry your blind faith clouds your objective views.

If you feel my posts are "junk" and are "clogging" up the boards, just put me on your ignore list.

Who would NOT like to see TEST DATA proving the DIADEM is "GENERALLY MORE =ACCURATE= than ANY COCKER, IMPY, or any other gun"???

That's a BIG statement!

I have asked simple and fair questions... yet I still see NO PROOF... :( :tdown:

[AM-Steve]

And honestly, I will not be able to give you anything that you would see as proof. We are not going to publish our tests. I would recommend that you test it yourself and see what you think. I will not say that the Diadem in every setup is more accurate than every other marker in any setup. But I stand by what I said -- from our internal testing, the Diadem is "generally" more accurate than most other guns. Take it or leave it, I won't be able to change your opinion.

And for those that see this as hype -- we are not posting ads that say this. I was again responding to a specific question with a specific answer. We have done tests proving this and therefore I do stand by what I said.

I would ask though that we take this to at least another thread to stop the clutter in this one -- we are trying to keep this board clean to the topic that each thread states. People that want to follow this argument are free to do so, but I would rather not have half of the people on the board, that are wanting legitimate Diadem information, getting emailed with every little argument that you and I have.

[Jack & Coke]

Originally posted by AM-Steve


...I will not be able to give you anything that you would see as proof...

...I will not say that the Diadem in every setup is more accurate than every other marker in any setup...



'nuff said...

:(

[Meph]

Hmmmmm, well, that's good enough for me. I have access to a Timmy, Angel Speed, Diadem, Automag, Autococker. Think all those side by side would be able to satisfy you J&C?

All I need now is somebody to sponsor my testing by supplying a set of barrel systems with Autococker and Angel backs! Since using stock barrels wouldn't be proper, it'd be MUCH more precise a review if I use the same barrel on each marker.

I can supply the markers and time and paint, I just need somebody to front the barrels. At least loan them.

[DaHick]

still no release date...

[Crash STP]

I'll supply the barrels if you want to do it at the next EMR event - your choice of Equation's or Freak's

why you bolt so quickly Meph after castle?

[Meph]

I jetted, those crab legs were not sitting well with me at all and there was no chance I'd have been able to play. Rest of the day I didn't even feel good.

And since I want ACCURACY tests I'll take the Equation over the Freak! Thank you ;)

Luckily most all of the markers are cocker threads, so that really makes this convenient. My automag, autococker, Illusion I'll bring. I'll talk to my friends and fast-talking them into letting me borrow their equipment. Though I'm not sure if The Chad will let me borrow the Speed all the way to EMR as compared to just right at the field here in Ithaca. But at least I can pry a Timmy outta somebodys' hands. There's enough of them around.

[Crash STP]

I have my eclipse team angel and I think we can come up w/ a LCD/IR3

[Meph]

Guess I'll have to get started on a mounting system. Some sort of little portable thing with a velcro strap (or something) to keep the said item secure. I had one a while ago but never got it back after I lent it out, so that kind of stinks.

[The Yellow Dart]

Hey, Meph are the airsmith at Ithaca Paintball.

[Meph]

Well, technically I "was" the airsmith there Kyle Smith! Only with college I've been too busy with homework and classes to actually be going down there. I think this past month, I went there twice!

So my airsmithing days have sort of come to a stalemated halt. At least lately for a while.

[r3zjimbo]

crap my angel didnt sell, listed on ebay, hope i have it sold in time for the release, still gonn have to come up with like 150 bux (damn angels lost the resale value)

[bushwhakersplinter]

i have a question for yah ramdragon. when will the diadems ship?

[RamDragon]

I'm not cleared to give that date, unfortunately.

We are still waiting for a few parts to come off the machines and some to come back from Ano. Until we can get a specific return date on those parts, we really can't post a definite release date.

Although Steve might have one by the time he gets back from World Cup.

[bushwhakersplinter]

i might be a little hostile but i am damn glad i am not playing in my next tourney cause i prolly wont have in time. even tho i was told that they would ship in about a week at castle

[ingenexec]

Hello all :) Sorry buswhaker bout the late diadem, that sucks, but consider the alternative: you get something that was in the same state as the first impy's, that doesnt work half the time cuz all the bugs aint totally worked out, or you get something thats not anno'd. We're all waiting, not just you. Now anyway, my question! Does anybody know if the diadem uses a leaf micro switch, or just the lil button one like a mouse uses? Just wondering, that makes the diff as to whether or not i can trigger walk it :D

[bushwhakersplinter]

whatever it is it is highly walkable

[ingenexec]

sounds like a plan to me :D i'm either going with this or the adjustable trigger. I know either way i'm adding a jam bolt, because i'm tired of not being able to use marballizer. And i like marbs, even if i cant shoot em :D later

[Draknes]

Why can't you shoot marb?

[Meph]

I think it's a leaf, but I don't recall too much about the switch.

Don't worry, I have a gut feeling you'll easily be able to walk it no sweat. Everybody else has.

[ingenexec]

*grins* yay! Now all i need is to know how much this bad boy costs lol

[sponge008]

When will the retro kit be available in relation to the Diadem's release? The same time, or a bit later?

[bushwhakersplinter]

600ish

[sponge008]

Ya $599 lol.

[ingenexec]

i dont mean the whole thing, i mean the damn kit >.< i need a front LPR and the asa with it, and whatever little goodies are really important

[RamDragon]

If you get the Sentinel with Diadem Upgrade installed (or the Diadem Sentinel) you will expect to pay $599. That has not changed. The Diadem Kit (LPR, inline main Reg, Trigger Frame, extended-volume chamber, and ram) as a drop in upgrade, around $400. The drop-in price is not yet carved in flesh, but it will be close to that figure.

[ingenexec]

HOLY JEEBUS! what happened to that old figure of 100 dollars? :P I was thinking just the single mode reciever (without grips even, i have those of my own) and a ram, along with the ported ASA and some cocker line, and that volume chamber, and thats all ya need! geez... Where'd 400 come from 100? Last thing i can afford is to cram 400 dollars into an already 500 dollar gun :P I've added too much, maybe, but i still love my baby :D please, electroP for cheaper?

[Gilman]

Is there a cost yet on individual parts? I want the low pressure chamber.

[FuzzyChicken]

Its still true that you can in a way pick and chose what upgrades you want? Will there be Sentinels with pre-upgraded Diadem conversion kit parts installed? (whoa that was a mouthfull) Any guesstimate on a date roughly? a year a month 3 months.. like what sorta? or still no speaking of the date?

[AM-Steve]

The lower cost ($100 or so) kit is not finished yet and that was listed as a target of ours. The Price that Ramdragon quoted was to get your Sentinel all the way up to the Diadem -- including everything needed. There will be packages available for those people that already have the regs or other parts that they need. These will be the cheaper packages.

[sponge008]

Could you PLEASE give us a date estimate?

[FuzzyChicken]

will AM have pre-made packages on Sentis available directly? Do to calrify can I in a way pick and choose what upgrades I want on my Senti?

[RamDragon]

Yes, Fuzzy-C, you will be able to ask for specific upgrades on your Sentinel, though the individual prices of the parts have not been set yet. And yes, you will be able to order your Sentinel with the factory installed Diadem upgrade. At least last I checked you could.

I actually SAW some Diadem trigger frames being assembled today, guys! We're getting really close here! I'm excited now, I don't know about you, but I am! Still no date, though. I'll probably know the day before :)

[ingenexec]

hey ram, did my gun show up at the store yet? i'm sittin around worried sick. mom wouldnt insure it for the price of a diadem lol.

[FuzzyChicken]

Sorry to keep bugging u guys and all but.... I have another lil question to annoy u guys with =\

Can I order a stock Senti and then instead of getting the stock tigger frame can I just get a Diadem trigger frame and just pay the difference in price from the two? Can I do the same for various parts? (if this doesnt make sense let me know so I can try and explain it better) SO what Im saying is picking and choosing the Diadem upgrades and not getting the stock Senti pieces and simply paying for the difference in price betweent the too and whatever labor costs I guess... The reason I ask is cuz I know I will want certain upgrades right off the bat and I dont want to throw away the stock parts in a sense and plus it will be cheaper then buying the stock parts and then buying the same upgraded part.

[Draknes]

So esentially you just want a base diadem...

[FuzzyChicken]

Originally posted by Draknes
So esentially you just want a base diadem...

Ya I guess, some of the upgrades that I am looking at are electro trigger frame, Rx barrel system with 2 inserts of my choice, advanced drop, maybe a new bolt, and maybe some others if I think of any later on. If this sounds feasable let me know AM, I will probably email u guys too when the conversion kits come out too.

BTW there is a massive PB campout this weekend with my rec baller friends and I cant really go since Im holdin out for the Diadem conversion kits and stuff, so I hope its worth it :P just dont have us wait too much longer.

[bushwhakersplinter]

i missed 1 touney and about a months play

[FuzzyChicken]

that sucks I have a feeling that they will be ready in 2-4 weeks but dont go by that... just a feeling

[ingenexec]

grr. i dont care about all this custom jazz. i just want mine lol. i'm not demanding it (i need my senti to work good first ;)) but i would def like to see it. thx!

[bushwhakersplinter]

waht sux is am steve said i would deffenetily have it by the tourney

[Draknes]

Originally posted by FuzzyChicken
Ya I guess, some of the upgrades that I am looking at are electro trigger frame, Rx barrel system with 2 inserts of my choice, advanced drop, maybe a new bolt, and maybe some others if I think of any later on. If this sounds feasable let me know AM, I will probably email u guys too when the conversion kits come out too.

BTW there is a massive PB campout this weekend with my rec baller friends and I cant really go since Im holdin out for the Diadem conversion kits and stuff, so I hope its worth it :P just dont have us wait too much longer.

Its not just an electro trigger frame. You would need to get a noid and a ram as well as regs, among other things... What you are asking for is a Diadem with a new bolt, drop, and another insert. That's going to set you back quite a bit.

[sponge008]

Lol, you beat me to it, Draknes.