Angels are open-bolt right? [Archive]

MM Engineering

08-04-2003, 09:46 PM

My friend thinks angel fire like an autococker. IE they start from a a closed bolt position, and fire in a closed bolt position. But they dont, once they are aired up, the bolt immediatly retracts, waiting for the next ball to be chambered, then when the trigger is pulled, the ram pushes the hammer forward, along with the bolt, and strikes the valve, which releases the air. There is NO possible way an angel can fire like an autococker. I happen to own an ACE'd 2k1 Dark LCD and im damn sure it isnt a cocker.

gremlin75

08-04-2003, 09:47 PM

Yes the angel is an open bolt marker

later
gremlin

Xadin

08-04-2003, 09:47 PM

its open bolt for sure heh, your friend is on the crack

MoogLe

08-04-2003, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by MM Engineering
My friend thinks angel fire like an autococker. IE they start from a a closed bolt position, and fire in a closed bolt position. But they dont, once they are aired up, the bolt immediatly retracts, waiting for the next ball to be chambered, then when the trigger is pulled, the ram pushes the hammer forward, along with the bolt, and strikes the valve, which releases the air. There is NO possible way an angel can fire like an autococker. I happen to own an ACE'd 2k1 Dark LCD and im damn sure it isnt a cocker.

you look like you know your stuff, why didnt you just lay it down on him, or just let him look in the feedneck when it's shooting

Fixxer77

08-04-2003, 11:48 PM

Or you could just punch him in the face and call him a liar in front of everyone. Just a thought.

;)

MM Engineering

08-04-2003, 11:49 PM

Originally posted by MoogLe
you look like you know your stuff, why didnt you just lay it down on him, or just let him look in the feedneck when it's shooting

He sad he gassed up his angel and the bolt went forward... yea right. The only way that would happen was if he was pressing the test button on the solenoid.

Funny thing is, another one of my friends says the same thing.. its funny eh?

*Leb*

08-05-2003, 01:00 AM

The main reason is, they get confused with closed bolt, and enclosed bolt. A lot of people think the angel is closed bolt because it has no visible moving bolt, Like the cocker. Therefore, I have given up righting the wrongs, and now i just go around ***** slapping everyone. I wouldn't say it solves problems, but it makes me feel like I can do some justice in the world.

suddenpaint

08-05-2003, 01:39 AM

isnt he special?

C]-[iLDe

08-05-2003, 01:55 AM

Originally posted by Fixxer77
Or you could just punch him in the face and call him a liar in front of everyone. Just a thought...

LOL i got a kick out of that, thanks.

Yeah angels have ALWAYS been open bolt.

Fixxer77

08-05-2003, 02:21 AM

:)

Not sure if it would solve anything, but it would sure make him look like an idiot.... Which he really should be slapped for thinking an angel is closed bolt (even when you said he looked down the feed tube).

Chillin_the_most

08-05-2003, 07:16 AM

I saw a picture a few weeks ago of an Angel LCD that some one altered th fire closed bolt. It had a front block on it like a cocker, Kind of ugly, but it's possible to have an Angel that's a closed bolt.

GTRsi

08-05-2003, 07:22 AM

Comment:

Most open bolt markers fire in a closed bolt postion.

hmmm...

digga

08-05-2003, 07:38 AM

i like fixxer 77's attidude.

Capt. Nitro

08-05-2003, 09:15 AM

Now remeber, there is a HUGE debate on weather or not close bolt operation improve accuracy. So i guess you could just tell your friend it dosent matter if it was closed bolt or open bolt, he's still gonna be walking to the dead box wearing the nice shades of your paint.

GTRsi

08-05-2003, 10:40 AM

Originally posted by Capt. Nitro
Now remeber, there is a HUGE debate on weather or not close bolt operation improve accuracy. So i guess you could just tell your friend it dosent matter if it was closed bolt or open bolt, he's still gonna be walking to the dead box wearing the nice shades of your paint.

But all guns shoot in closed bolt. So where is the debate?

Chillin_the_most

08-05-2003, 11:07 AM

GTRsi, what the hell are you talking about?

Richy_C

08-05-2003, 11:17 AM

All gun fire when the bolt is in the forward position. Not leaving the breach open. Thus it is "closed."

Remember the first Matrix ads? "Fires in closed bolt mode," Just marketing crap, every gun does that.

iKiLlEdiT29

08-05-2003, 11:22 AM

i think i know what he's sayin, all gun shoot when the bolt is forward. Thats true. Capt. Nitro was stating that the debate is whether or not a gun that starts its cycle closed is more accurate. And i kinda agree with GTRsi, if all guns shoot with the bolt forward, why does the start of there cycle matter? (accuracy wise)

EDIT: I type slow so Richy passes me up.

GTRsi

08-05-2003, 12:29 PM

Originally posted by iKiLlEdiT29
And i kinda agree with GTRsi, if all guns shoot with the bolt forward, why does the start of there cycle matter? (accuracy wise)

agree,
Intresting to see the closed bolt guys scream and yell about accuracy when in reality they all fire closed bolt. Infact does the bolt postion really matter when firring rapidly? The bolt is cycling so fast that the notion of low kick operation due to bolt postion is an incorrect assumption.

just a few thoughts of mine.

*Leb*

08-05-2003, 03:52 PM

What I understand, closed bolt guns tend to be slower. Instead of having 2 action points (bolt moves forward, releases air) they have 3, (bolt moves, bolt moves forward, releases air) The only gun that doesn't fit this is E-Blades... Did they do something to the firing procedure?

MoogLe

08-05-2003, 05:06 PM

Originally posted by Fixxer77
Or you could just punch him in the face and call him a liar in front of everyone. Just a thought.

;)

hahahahah, that's great, i love this place :)

Fixxer77

08-05-2003, 05:08 PM

Hey, if it works. Do it.

Right?

p8ntballdude

08-05-2003, 06:31 PM

Leb ur confusing me. but i get ur point. all the angel has to do is move the hammer forward and back, and the bolt moves with it. but with cockers it has to move the bolt back and all the sudden add the pressure of the hammer. and the hammer on cockers is pushing againts springs on its way back, unlike the angel. thus making it slower.

the angel has to move one thing with minimal force needed. the cocker needs to move the bolt, and then the hammer and springs at one point. and no they didn't do anything to the eblades, it still funstions the same way. you might be thinking of the firestorm kit or sumpthin. the eblade, race, and any other cocker all function the same way, but the electro ones have a solenoid.

DEATHFIST

08-05-2003, 06:37 PM

people say that the position of the bolt at the start of the cycle matters accuracy wise is because the ball itself is not in motion. the only action going on at this time is the hammer moving forward and striking the valve... also people say there is less kick because of this (only one part moving at a time) and that the marker may be more stable .....

with open bolt markers the ball is in motion all the time..

i think warpig did a test with a modified spyder and shot it in both the open and closed bolt position and found that there was no difference in acuracy because of the positon of the bolt....

Fixxer77

08-05-2003, 08:06 PM

My angel and cocker shoot the exact same way, never even noticed a difference.

All that BS about a "cocker shoots farther" or a "cocker is more accurate" is a cocker owner wishing they had bought an angel.

MM Engineering

08-05-2003, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by Fixxer77
My angel and cocker shoot the exact same way, never even noticed a difference.

All that BS about a "cocker shoots farther" or a "cocker is more accurate" is a cocker owner wishing they had bought an angel.

Well said.

Richy_C

08-05-2003, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by *Leb*
What I understand, closed bolt guns tend to be slower. Instead of having 2 action points (bolt moves forward, releases air) they have 3, (bolt moves, bolt moves forward, releases air) The only gun that doesn't fit this is E-Blades... Did they do something to the firing procedure? Release air, bolt back, then bolt forward for closed bolt guns. Other wise it'd just be an Impulse with all that pesky bolt stick. :)

*Leb*

08-05-2003, 11:09 PM

No. I am almost sure it's bolt back, paintball drops in, bolt forward, release air.

MoogLe

08-05-2003, 11:15 PM

Fixxer77

08-06-2003, 10:13 AM

Awwww :)

Richy_C

08-06-2003, 03:22 PM

Originally posted by *Leb*
No. I am almost sure it's bolt back, paintball drops in, bolt forward, release air. No. Think about if you pull the bolt back on a Cocker with no air, push it forward, pull the trigger. It "pings", that sound is the hammer hitting the valve. According to your logic, that action shouldn't happen until the pneumatics reset, which can't happen to a gun with no air. Trust me dude.

player4real

08-15-2003, 02:14 AM

fire storm is one of the only guns that releses air from the open bolt position. And what would you call a nova cuz the barrel moves to close off the chamber i think it would be closed.