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View Full Version : Illusion conversion?

Lykoi
10-08-2002, 02:55 PM
I just started looking at these markers, and have been intrigued by some of the quality I have seen... although they appear somewhat low-end, I have heard nothing but praise on the performance and durability of all the guns..

after looking, I have one simple question, which would make me buy one almost immediately...

In theory and in reality could a set of pnues replace the pump no the illusion?? I think it'd be tite of them to release a body milled like that that could be converted... or even produce a converted illusion...

also, nothing else matters, if I can get a front block mounted to it, I think I'd buy one... not that pump/stock class isn't awesome, and the marker would still be used as one.. but I'd love to pull that out for a supair game and surprise the hell outta everyone else.


any info will help... thanks
Benson
10-08-2002, 10:43 PM
Last I knew there were no immeadiate plans for anything of that sort. I heard something about it awhile back, but it wasn't confirmed. Unfortunately, I can think of a large number of problems you'll run into trying a conversion gripframe, mounting,ect. I am too tired to sit and make a list of stuff you'd need to do for the conversion right now. I bet it can be done, but unless you know what you're getting into it'll be really hard.

If you want something that rips without a whole lot of work, wait a month or so for the diadem...
Lykoi
10-09-2002, 12:36 AM
don't want another gun... I want an illusion bodied cocker..
gripframe looks to be the same screw position... not 100% tho...
I need to knbow from someone with %100 clarity on the subject thnks tho
Jackel411
10-09-2002, 02:44 PM
Cant be done... the body isnt even close to a cockers... if anything it closer to the earlyt AKA VLM Spyder bodies
Lykoi
10-09-2002, 05:31 PM
is it a closed bolt pump?? does it have the hammer and valve from the cocker style??
Jackel411
10-09-2002, 05:36 PM
the only thing on this close to a cocker part is the bolt.. and even then a cockers will not work...
Lykoi
10-09-2002, 05:46 PM
how is the only thing on it close to a cocker the bolt.. .the sniper which this gun is obviouslyt modeled after is the frickin cocker... I just want to knokw how the pump arm is attached thru the front, and I'd appreciate more than a NO, to my q2uestions..
Jackel411
10-09-2002, 05:52 PM
The internals WILL NOT FIT ON A COCKER!!!!!!!!!!!

They are wider , shorter and HUH! gasp... different , the valve is closer to a sterlings as it has no jam nut , the pump rod is bolted to the pump , the cocking rod is part of the hammer not screwed into , and the front " pump rod " is part of the valve , its where the spring and velocity screw sits.....

trust me I own one its sitting infront of me... there isnt a cocker part other than a barrel that will fit,
Benson
10-09-2002, 06:42 PM
Jacke is right they have very different internals.

If you're looking for something that's practical and will save you money, this conversion idea won't be it. I can see what you're getting at... this is a pump gun, so there must be a way of getting it to shoot semi. I bet there is, and you're thinking of mounting cocker pnematics, hooking a ram to the pump arms, ect. I wouldn't mess with it (it'd take a ton of work and more than likely look messy).

If you are dead set on it and money isn't an issue, I'd say go on the waiting list with doc or punisher as they would be the ones to do it right and make it look good.
Lykoi
10-10-2002, 02:38 AM
ok... thanks.. I was not lookin for a cheap alternative, simply I like the design of the body... for the moment money=big issue.... I was simply curious if some machining would do the trick or it would take a whole new design.. I appreciate the info, and all the ppl that took time to answer in a polite well mannered way.
The Inflicted
10-10-2002, 08:23 PM
Well, if we're being totally theoretical here, sure, it could be done, and it wouldn't be that hard either. All you would need is a custom-machined front velocity adjuster screw that doubled as a frontblock to mount the ram, regulator, and 3-way. You would need a different ASA for clearance to the trigger, and apart from finding a way to time the gun off of the Illusion's wacky slide/swing trigger you're done.

Alternatively, you could improve upon the cocker's design and make it a reversed pneumatic gun like a Typhoon. Side-tapping the body for the regulator wouldn't be a problem (See the Diadem for an example) and a side-mount for the ram could be done too as it has been on numerous reversed cockers. The trick would be finding a way to mount the 4-way in the grip frame ALA a Palmer gun, which would be the tricky part. Once that's done, route the gas lines up through holes in the grip panels to the other two pneumatic components and it works.

Considering the Illusion's wacky trigger, it might actually be easier to go route #2 and actually make it a half-electronic gun like the PMS Electrococker. Have the trigger trip the sear manually and then have a microswitch under the trigger activate a 9-Volt powered electronic valve for the pneumatics. This sounds more complex but would actually save some headaches in getting the 4-way to acuate correctly. The trouble here is that the additional electronic parts would need to go in an F-5 ish black box or on the side of the gun. I'D put the on the sight rail, which is what AM should have done with their Diadem.

All told, I'm estimating the conversion would be about $400 or less.
Lykoi
10-11-2002, 02:18 AM
I agree with the reverse cocker part... much simpler than a block mount.. but hte trigger would have to be replaced to trip a pnuematic valve... no way the hinge style trigg on the gun could trip a sear and pull the 1mm plus length to reset a 3 way... I'd prolly be best t go with a sterling style conversion... and have teh 3 way internal and the eam mounted on the side, and the reg adjusted from the front...
AM-Steve
10-11-2002, 06:28 PM
The Illusion definitely can be made into a pneumatically operated semi-auto (ala Autococker) we didn't design it for this however. We designed the Illusion to be the best pump marker that it could be. This is always our philosophy when designing a marker -- we design each marker to perform the best that we can do. There is a definite possibility of use turning the Illusion into a semi-auto at some point in the future, but we do not have any time frame on that.